Asking prospective students for their skin color when they apply to your school should be unthinkable.
"I want to attend your school just like my grandfather" = This is fine
"I want to attend your school because my grandfather wasn't allowed to" = This is not
Think about that for a second.
Legacy admissions shouldn't be a thing either, imo. It should be 100% about merit.
Absolutely.
And until that's the case, there's a clear double standard that benefits white people.
Wait is this actually a thing?
Legacy is a much more weighted merit than affirmative action was.
But asking them who their father is is fine?
If people gave a shit about fairness they'd care about legacy admission more than affirmative action.
No, that's not fine either and should also be outlawed due to a history of systemic racism giving some people an advantage over others.
It should be 100% merit based, plain and simple. It's the only fair way.
Funny how we addressed the tool that helped black kids first, rather than the one that hurt them.
Maybe it's because this is being pushed by bad people, that you seem to agree with under some fantasy of "100% merit based" reality.
Systemic biases exist, AA compensated for them banking AA is basically pretending this nation isn't racist AF.
Honestly, asking anyone for race on any application for anything shouldn't be a thing. With the exception of medical things specific to race, it's completely unnecessary. Unless I'm missing something glaring, other than perpetuating systematic disenfranchisement.
While I agree that requiring people to reveal their ethnicity should be a no-no for anything other than medical, asking for people to volunteer this information makes sense.
In UK in many places giving ethnicity is optional and the results are used to monitor how different groups aka "races" are doing. This then can be used for research.
This is honestly great to hear. I have heard calls for this for years, and have repeatedly seen stats that show how Affirmative Action can end up hurting lots of people's chances at acceptance to universities. See: https://www.aei.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/med1.jpg?x91208
I just wish that, based on their recent track record, I knew that the Supreme Court had passed this ruling with good intentions.
I worked in admissions, and believe me,igt is atrocious for equitable access to education. I'll give an example:
Applicant 1: Manhattan, Elite HS, Leader Of 2 clubs, traveled the world, received SAT training for 4 year, GPA 3.5. No hurdles in live whatsoever
Applicant 2: Rural Alabama, works 20h in McD since 12, 1 Club membership, takes care of 2 siblings because parents are addicts. SAT average, 3.5 GPA
Now thanks to affirmative action,you can contextualize what each student attained and overcame to achieve their test results and GPA. Applicant 2 has had to work much harder to get that GPA, with barely any freetime, and affirmative action will recognize that. In the end, admission should not be about the best HS grade, but about who will be performing best at university, so its about potential. And SAT and GPA doesn't tell much about potential if not contextualized.
It's such a small weight in the overall judgement (according to the selection metrics published by universities) that I'm doubtful much will change. And another dog whistle becomes obsolete for the right wing.
If it was so irrelevant, the colleges would not have fought tooth and nail to maintain it. Anyway, the prior experience of individual states that have banned affirmative action indicates that the effects are not negligible -- it's responsible for double digit shifts in racial compositions of student bodies.
Things will depend on how the universities respond; one can imagine Harvard doubling down on ever-subtler ways to tag Asians as personality-free robots undeserving of consideration.
A lot of things that US courts have recently done(this included) is making making me wonder about how judicial review should work. Because what I keep seeing is that US courts will strike down shitty band aid solutions(which AA was, it was an attempt at a quick and easy solution for a very long list of social issues) without offering better alternatives. I do think that affirmative action should not have to exist, but the better choice is full scale education reform, addressing systemic racism, an understanding of how privilege affects educational outcomes, and greater availability and lower cost of the highest quality tertiary education. As it is today I am observing courts not choosing perfect over good, but rather destroying half baked solutions because they oppose the intended outcomes of those solutions.
How about the likes of Harvard bitching and moaning about this, replaced "affirmative action" with measures to make it easier for students from poorer backgrounds to attend it, which would probably help way more people of latin and afro-american ancestry (who in the most tend to be poorer than average) than this system of "quotas for people who went to nice schools and can afford Harvard student fees" that mainly helps the scions of high-middle and richer parents whose only thing in common with the vast majority of people in the minorities supposedly being helped is a handful of genes?
You can measure the dripping hypocrisy and sense of entitlement of the people defending certain (maybe most) "afirmative action" measures by just well-off compared to the vast majority of the population those "helped" by it are (a particularly obvious one is "quotas for CxO positions for women" - it's not going to be women from poor backgrounds who work as cleaning-ladies that will benefit from such quotas, but rather a handful of women from much better off backgrounds than 99% of people)
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