495

TELL ME (xpost from Leaky_Cauldron@diagonlemmy.social ) (lemmy.world)

submitted 5 months ago by The_Picard_Maneuver@lemmy.world to c/lotrmemes@midwest.social

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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/16243150

TELL ME

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[-] MajorMajormajormajor@lemmy.ca 54 points 5 months ago

He asked calmly.

[-] chemicalwonka@discuss.tchncs.de 6 points 5 months ago

I just came for this comment. Thanks

[-] CitizenKong@lemmy.world 28 points 5 months ago

Fun fact: McKellen was asked to play Dumbledore after Richard Harris passed but he declined because he didn't want to be typecast.

[-] boredsquirrel@slrpnk.net 23 points 5 months ago

Typecast means that after 2 roles he would have only been hired for wizards from now on?

[-] gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 23 points 5 months ago

The clue is in the word itself - it’s actually a spell that prevents you from being selected to portray literally anything else for the rest of your career as an actor.

[-] MajorMajormajormajor@lemmy.ca 10 points 5 months ago

YOU SHALL NOT TYPECAST!!

[-] gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 9 points 5 months ago

Character actor = ian_mckellan (Dumbledore);

[-] nxdefiant@startrek.website 4 points 5 months ago

Unless you've been DuckTypeCast, in which case you can be anything (this is what happened to Gary Oldman)

[-] CitizenKong@lemmy.world 7 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Well, maybe not wizard typecast, but typecast to play much older than he was. He was only 63 when he first played Gandalf. To put it in perspective, that's only one year older than Tom Cruise is right now.

[-] threelonmusketeers@sh.itjust.works 2 points 5 months ago

typecast to play much older than he was. He was only 63 when he first played Gandalf

Isn't Gandalf a multi-thousand-year-old immortal angel of sorts? Seems like a bit of a strange concern in that context...

[-] CitizenKong@lemmy.world 1 points 5 months ago

Yeah, but he's described as having the form of a wizened old man.

[-] stebo02@sopuli.xyz 2 points 5 months ago

I guess it might lead to some snowball effect

[-] Lucidlethargy@sh.itjust.works 3 points 5 months ago

What we got instead was awful.

[-] FiniteBanjo@lemmy.today 6 points 5 months ago

There is a funny Studio C sketch where the two get mixed up and go through a checklist to confirm their identity, and Dumbledore checks all the Gandalf boxes and Harry checks all the Frodo boxes.

[-] WaterWaiver@aussie.zone 6 points 5 months ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KmXPcSxz2g

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[+] MindTraveller@lemmy.ca -13 points 5 months ago

Harry Potter is a slavery-justifying neoliberal wank written by a transphobic fascist, and it deserves to be forgotten.

[-] TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world 12 points 5 months ago

It's perfectly fine to like the art and not the artist, you know.

[+] MindTraveller@lemmy.ca -7 points 5 months ago

I don't like the art, it's poorly written. Harry watches the government get taken over by fascists and then decides to go be a cop. Plus it excuses slavery

[-] TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world 8 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Harry watches the government get taken over by fascists and then decides to go be a cop.

Not every police force is the ultra-militarised right wing type you see in North America. I must admit I'm quite tired of people thinking US culture applies worldwide. There's a whole world outside of the USA. You need to accept that just because something is one way in the US, doesn't mean it's that way everywhere.

I'm currently living in the UK and despite their police force often being useless due to 14 years of Conservatives underfunding them, I'll give them credit for not being violent and being extremely adept at de-escalation, and for regularly and overwhelmingly saying no when they are surveyed and offered more lethal weapons. They adamantly do not want more power. Police in the UK, as a general rule, lean left, not right.

Of course you do occasionally hear about a police officer doing something dodgy, but it's pretty rare and makes national or even international news when it happens.

There's very much a culture of them working for the public as opposed to being a military force that terrorises the public.

Plus the government previously being fascist doesn't mean people working for them are fascist, particularly not after a change in government. Harry became an Auror when Hermione became Minister of Magic. It wasn't a fascist government then. Is every public sector employee in Spain, Italy, Germany, etc a fascist just because they had a fascist government in the past?

I don't like the art, it's poorly written.

Poorly written, sure, I'd say a lot of it is too (so time-turners canonically exist but nobody goes back to stop Voldemort or stop victims from being killed by him? Ok lol), but so are lots of things. Not everybody is a Tolkien-level world-builder.

Regardless, it doesn't change the point, you can think JKR is a transphobic twat and still like a book. Rudyard Kipling has some great poems and books, despite being racist. Roald Dahl wrote brilliant childrens books despite being a raving antisemite. As an Indian, I have great respect for Ghandi, despite him being racist, enormously antisemitic, and likely even paedophilic. The Smiths made great music despite Morrissey being a cunt. Etc.

If you want to discard work on account of the artist's personalities, then fair enough, more power to you, it's a personal thing what your boundaries are. I'm just saying it's fine to like the art but not the artist too.

[-] MindTraveller@lemmy.ca -4 points 5 months ago

I thought you said to like the art and not the artist. Hermione becoming minister for magic isn't canon, it's WoG via the cursed child. It's not the art. You're saying to separate it from the artist, but you're basing your evaluation on decisions made by the artist years later. Hypocrite.

[-] TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world 2 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Where have I said I like JKR? Where's the hypocrisy?

You were the one who brought up events after the books, now I'm not to talk about it otherwise it's somehow an endorsement of transphobia or something? Lmao

And of course it's still art - it's part of the world that the author created. I don't see how you could possibly argue that it isn't. It's HP universe stuff.

Do the events of The Silmarillion not count as art, because it came out years after the LOTR trilogy?

[-] MindTraveller@lemmy.ca -1 points 5 months ago

Harry decides to become a cop during the original books. And if you're going to make decisions about the quality of the books based on fanfic, then so will I. I'll asset that Harry Potter sucks because Ebony Dark'ness Dementia Raven Way is a mary sue and the prose in My Immortal is terrible.

[-] TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world 1 points 5 months ago

Auror, not cop.

And again, stop asserting that other police forces are like that of the US. Other countries exist and have different cultures, curb your nationalism just a little bit.

I never mentioned fanfic, this is again you going off on a wild tangent.

[-] MindTraveller@lemmy.ca -1 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

I'm not an American, you're the one who keeps talking about the US, Cursed Child is fanfiction, and aurors enforced fascist laws during Voldemort's coup, which Harry knows from direct lived experience.

[-] TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world 2 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

You keep bringing up US political dynamics.

Stuff from the author is not fanfiction. I think you need to brush up on what fanfiction means. You'd think the meaning would be obvious since the word quite literally describes itself.

And yes, a fascist government imposed fascism in the HP universe... Then a non-fascist government succeeded it... honestly, how is this hard to grasp?

[-] Flummoxed@lemmy.world 2 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Can we try to replace Potter with The Earthsea books? So clear Rowling stole many ideas from Le Guin, and Le Guin herself was amazing. Tons of essays, etc. to get the drift of her ideas. Or Once and Future King? Not as big of a fan of the second series, but the first part is lovely and edifying like the early Potter books.

Edit: could any of the downvoters share their rationale? Not mad, and if it's just the wrong sub to suggest it because duh, replace it with LOR, that's okay. I'm good with that too. Any other reasons out there?

[-] Corkyskog@sh.itjust.works 4 points 5 months ago

I didn't downvote you, but I would guess the other down votes come from not describing why they are similar, or what they are about.

[-] Flummoxed@lemmy.world 3 points 5 months ago

Thank you, that is an actually good point.

Earthsea centers around a boy who shows magical abilities, so he's sent to Wizarding School.

But you don't have to take my word for it... Wiki

[-] MindTraveller@lemmy.ca 1 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

You're being downvoted by transphobes. I upvoted you.

[-] Flummoxed@lemmy.world 1 points 5 months ago

Ugh, I hope you aren't right, but probably.

[-] MindTraveller@lemmy.ca -1 points 5 months ago

You know what they say, "scratch a potterhead and a fascist bleeds"

[-] Flummoxed@lemmy.world 4 points 5 months ago

No, I'd never heard that. Unfortunately, it doesn't surprise me, but it does fuck with my view of a few people I've known...

[-] MindTraveller@lemmy.ca -1 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

I'm playing on the old leftist saying "scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds". There's a potterhead in this thread glorifying the UK police, as if England didn't historically host a huge punk and anarchist movement, and massive anti police sentiment.

You see, the only thing a liberal believes in politically is their own personal convenience. Leftism is all about justice, equality, and putting in the hard work to support each other. Fascism is all about convincing you that it's in your own interest to attack minorities. So when a liberal is inconvenienced (or their favourite book is attacked), suddenly they care about politics and they radicalise. And the direction they radicalise is to the right.

If someone's made Harry Potter central to their identity, an attack on Potter is an attack on them. They feel the need to defend themselves. And how do you defend a fascist's books? You use fascist talking points. Potterheads will always justify slavery, glorify the police, and make excuses for transphobia until the day they stop defining themselves by that book.

[-] nova_ad_vitum@lemmy.ca 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Damn, you miserable as fuck.

this post was submitted on 06 Jun 2024

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