They owned up to it, and immediately dealt with the issue.

It's open source, free, and run by volunteers who bust their asses to make these releases happen. I wouldn't worry too much about it if it's been working the other 99% of the time for you, and this one issue has you on the fence about it...

Fedora is Fedora and uBlue is uBlue, a separate project. Blaming Fedora for uBlue issues is like blaming Ubuntu for Mint issues.

And on Silverblue issues on updated happen from time to time. On immutable distros such issues won't break the system unrecoverable, this is the whole reason for immutables, but there are no promises for lacking of issues.

And you are disappointed because you have encountered two different issues at once. But it is a purely random event, and I have not noticed any changes in frequency.

But saying about Silverblue, I think probably it doesn't get much attention from the Fedora project lately, because few recent releases didn't have any improvements either.

The beauty of Fedora Atomic is that anyone effected by the recent update (including me) could simply rollback to the previous image and boot as normal in order to troubleshoot. This is exactly why nearly all of my devices are running Silverblue or Kinoite now.

I think it's worth mentioning that significant bugs happen across all major OS platforms.

Recently, Microsoft pushed a patch requiring effected users to manually resize their EFI recovery partition. Shortly after that, it was announced that all Apple Silicon Macs suffered from an unpatchable vulnerability which can defeat encryption. These are just a couple of examples from recent memory...there are many others.

To truly avoid serious software vulnerabilities or bugs is to avoid software entirely. Operating systems are highly complex, multilayered software, and shit happens.

I’m not. This is the toll one pays for getting absolutely free operating systems and programs without any real catch. No one to our knowledge is making money off of data collected by our use of the OS so if there are some bugs like that, I find it perfectly acceptable given the alternative where I pay a license to have windows installed on one computer and also get my data mined by Microsoft and my data sold to thousands of third parties.

Did you experience the Silverblue issue on a ublue image? We mitigated that last month so you should only have one problem or the other, not both.

Upstream Fedora is pretty bad with troubleshooting.

I honestly think the traditional Fedora with dnf is bad. I tried it and it was a pain. But the packages are pretty nice.

The issue is: Fedora is a testing platform. Their kernels are fresh. Fedora Atomic is not a finished product (and also not marketed as such in any way).

uBlue literally uses unreleased quay OCI images of Fedora atomic. They are built, but not used. The official ones are not even signed.

Fedora is not a stable distro at all. So they should focus a lot on

• testing if the damn kernel boots on real hardware
• having easy and always accessible fallbacks
• having troubleshooting help everywhere

Also, as most problems are because

• outdated grub (fixed soon with F41 likely, only on atomic)
• too new kernel
• weird kernel module stuff
• rpmfusion sync issues

Many problems can be avoided by using a different Kernel!

Kwizart maintains the official LTS Kernel, built for Fedora, CentOS and RHEL

Replacing the kernel with this may be a solution for many problems

Use my COPR command script

copr enable kwizart/kernel-longterm-6.6
rpm-ostree install kernel-longterm

Not sure if then both are kept.

My takeaway was add https://universal-blue.discourse.group/tag/announcements.rss to my rss reader (already had fedora) and I'm happy I'll know when I need to, still for those of us who support non-technical users on these platforms it is indeed problematic.

OTOH, this is the first time I've had non-nvidia (sleep broken on my desktop, just rolled back and held updating for a while, no big deal) update problems in two years, which is pretty outstanding for a new rolling distro, and gives me confidence in the architecture. Shit happens I guess, but it was quickly and publicly sorted, also trust building...

I agree that Fedora Atomic NEEDS a way to have GUI messages via an RSS feed arrive to all users by default.

KDE Plasma has an RSS widget by default I think. Will open a discussion about that.

Yeah, it all still is more experimental than I'd hope. The whole reason I'm using Silverblue is low maintenance and less risk.

The plus side is that it didn't render my system unusable - I could boot into the old version. But hopefully lessons will have been learned, and this will happen less often in the future.

I am. Cant boot after update because of secureboot stuff

Keep an eye on CentOS bootc

And the CentOS hyperscale SIG (Youtube presentation, newer update) is basically taking CentOS and backporting or just using tons of Fedora packages on there, for better performance.

I think they use the Fedora Kernel which would still be problematic, as the current 6.6 LTS kernel is still way newer than the 5.14 CentOS kernel (with tons of backports).

You are completely right, they've dropped the ball. Of course it's open source, so the devs are not duty bound to keep the system running well. it's just that my trust is shaken that I could just set up grandma's computer with this and not need to maintain it..

These days even Apple and Microsoft struggle with testing their updates and pushing out updates that are not broken or system breaking. Maybe the grans of the world should just become more tech savvy. ;)

Then again if long term Fedora immutable systems only fail like this once every two years, then we are not really worse than needing to deal with Windows Rot.

I think the problem ist accepting that people don't want to understand or be informed about a thing that their life depends on.

Everything gets more technical so there has to be a basic understanding how things work or else you are fucked in one way or the other.

If you walk on the streets you don't have to know the max speed on a highway but you need to know how traffic lights work or you get run over.

Or, be like me, and use secureblue (or any other community image) and don't experience any of these issues.

on the flip side, Linux, the distros, the desktops are a lot more about community than anything Windows – and Linux projects are a lot more willing to admit they can’t operate in isolation – there’s constant interplay between the projects, the security teams, the kernel hackers, the language devs, the testers, and the users – and they communicate with each other through the blogs and mailing lists and IRC and toots and Fedi communities

I don't see atomic systems on desktop computers. They make sense on more embedded and stable systems that still need eventual updates like ATMs and industrial machinery control panels but not desktops. Atomic systems kill customization that is one of the core advantages of Linux. Probably it also has something to do with my not-so-enthusiastic opinion on Flatpak idk.