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submitted 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) by Social_Discussion@lemm.ee to c/asklemmy@lemmy.ml

Hey everyone, I'm new to Lemmy and just starting to figure this site out. I mainly moved here because of the censorship on Reddit where they didn't publish posts that included the slightest word not allowed by their filter and they removed/blocked lots of content. I wonder if it will be somewhat better here (on the official site it says "Censorship resistant - By hosting your own server, you can be in full control of your content.").

The weird thing I saw with Lemmy was when I wanted to sign-up on the "lemmy.ml" server instance that according to the official Lemmy Servers listing page is a "A community of privacy and FOSS enthusiasts, run by Lemmy’s developers".

So I thought I try that one when it's from Lemmy's own developers. When I wanted to sign-up it required an application that you needed to fill out with one of the requirements being having to copy a sentence from the link provided which links to some article called "The Principles of Communism" which I thought was very odd for a site to do. I've never seen a site like this promoting some ideology that directly where it's part of the sign-up process to almost pledge to some political or religious ideology.

This seemed very sketchy to me. Does anyone know something about this?

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[-] AnnaFrankfurter@lemmy.ml 31 points 2 days ago

Yeah lemmy.ml is full of commie bastards...😂😂😂

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[-] SorteKanin@feddit.dk 24 points 2 days ago

The fediverse is not really about avoiding censorship as it is about providing choice. That means the choice to listen to who you want to listen to (i.e. what servers to (de)federate from/to), the choice to post whatever you want (but you might get banned from your own instance or any other instance, that's their prerogative), the choice of administrators and moderators (i.e. which instance you sign up to and what communities you participate in).

All of that stuff doesn't really have to do with censorship directly, but it has implications for censorship. The fediverse is not built primarily to avoid censorship though, and in some cases it is made to make "censorship" (moderation) easier, rather than harder.

[-] StrawberryPigtails@lemmy.sdf.org 72 points 2 days ago

Welcome to the Fediverse! Somebody has probably told you this, but I just realized that I forgot to hit "Post" before I went to dinner. Here it is anyways.

When I wanted to sign-up it required an application that you needed to fill out with one of the requirements being having to copy a sentence from the link provided which links to some article called “The Principles of Communism” which I thought was very odd for a site to do. I’ve never seen a site like this promoting some ideology that directly where it’s part of the sign-up process to almost pledge to some political or religious ideology.

The applications and copying of a particular line is a simple form of spam prevention. The fact that the line is from “The Principles of Communism" is probably because the owners of that particular instance (who are also the main developers) are communist. I believe they also run Lemmygrad, which is full on Marxist, and one of the more commonly blocked instances. Lemmy.ml is intended to be a more mainstream instance but like much of the Fedi leans hard left.

I mainly moved here because of the censorship on Reddit where they didn’t publish posts that included the slightest word not allowed by their filter and they removed/blocked lots of content. I wonder if it will be somewhat better here

Lemmy is censorship resistant, but not censorship free. There is a difference. Censorship (or moderation, depending on your view point) happens at 3 levels, user, community, and instance. You can't do much if other users find you obnoxious and decide to block you, but if you find the moderation of a community to be over bearing and if your current instance allows, you can create your own community from your current instance and mod it how you see fit within the guidelines of your instance. If you find your instance's moderation to be overbearing, you can create your own instance and moderate it however you see fit. However, you will still be subject to the moderation policies of the communities (and their home instances) that you subscribe to.

In the Fedi you have absolute freedom of speech, but nobody is required to give you a soapbox or megaphone and nobody is required to listen to you.

[-] GarbageShoot@hexbear.net 79 points 2 days ago

To their credit, I think the Principles of Communism thing is partially meant as a floodgate, since the devs really do believe in their project and want to avoid over-centralization from everyone defaulting to one instance. They know many people will go "What the hell? No!" and go somewhere else and that's exactly the point. I'd be surprised if they really thought it would get almost anyone to engage with Marxism with the prompt, especially since you can copy the first sentence of the text and not read anything else (and even just reading it is not engaging with it). I think it's more like a little joke.

Also, copying a sentence of your choice to a pamphlet is not a pledge and I think it's silly to view it that way. If it helps, iirc, one of the sentences that appears is "No." and they will accept that as an answer.

But assuming this was "promoting an ideology directly," would you find it less sketchy for an instance to promote ideology indirectly? Because if you aren't directly doing ideology, that just means you are indirectly doing it (sometimes very deliberately). Personally, I appreciate transparency.

[-] _pi@lemmy.ml 6 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

I think it's very funny that a lot of people will post "omg communism boogeyman? is this legal????", but they won't do a very basic introspection of ideology and online community moderation which is at the core the entire intent here.

Almost every lemmy instance has the same rule 1, those rules textually are often the same, those rules are often have the same meanings, but those rules are unevenly enforced between instances based on the ideology of that instance. That's why you can be a transphobe on .world without actually getting the same amount of mod action going your way as if you were a transphobe on hexbear/lemmy.ml/lemmygrad/blahaj.

Furthermore there's sociopolitical drama between the instances like between blahaj and hexbear on what transphobia actually is and what level of irony is allowed.

A lot of people interpret rule 1 as "don't be mean" rather than "be mean in ways that aren't racist/bigoted/sexist/transphobic/etc". Which is why they often complain that certain communities they can't post certain words, but user can dog pile them with community approved shitposting.

And then there's the lib instances who think that being mean to the Ukrainian war effort online is rule 1 and if not it's rule no disinformatsiya.

It's like when Twitter had to clarify, you cannot call for violence unless it's a call for violence that is part of the United States of America's foreign policy, because Trump as POTUS called for violence over Twitter as part of US FP. But we gotta always put the the damn commies under the microscope for making us copypasta Marxist thought.

[-] griefstricken@lemmy.ml 73 points 2 days ago

Open source is inherently political and you depend on software being developed by communists. We are here to evade corporate censorship, censor reactionaries, spread agitprop, and discuss raising the quality of life of all working people.

Not just tech workers. Everyone.

[-] _ed@sopuli.xyz 43 points 2 days ago

The fact that each instance can have its own rules and culture is f a b. I love that’s one of the criteria. Mander.xyz should have a ‘identify all the creatures from the Triassic’ image captcha.

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[-] CrimeDad@lemmy.crimedad.work 70 points 2 days ago

Seems like a simple task to help verify that you are not a bot. It might also help deter applicants who are anti-communist. I guess you solved the problem for yourself by choosing a different instance.

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[-] rentasonder@lemmygrad.ml 53 points 2 days ago
[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 40 points 2 days ago
[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 52 points 2 days ago

The developers of Lemmy are Communists, they don't hide this fact.

To answer your first question, there are no "free speech" instances in wide use, depending on your point of view an instance might be "censoring" or fighting "misinformation." It's up to you to pick an instance you want.

[-] can@sh.itjust.works 51 points 2 days ago

Censorship resistant - By hosting your own server, you can be in full control of your content.").

Yes, exactly, you can host your own or sign up at one someone's already hosts. The resistance is in the ability to choose which admins you trust and align with your views while still interacting with the rest of us.

The devs run their own and have their own rules and censorship but you don't have to sign up there. Does that help?

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[-] Kuori@hexbear.net 24 points 2 days ago

lemmy was made by communists. if you don't like it go back to reddit.

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[-] eldavi@lemmy.ml 34 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

most people have answered your questions so i want to chime in with the information that i wish someone had told me when i first joined:

a lot of people came to lemmy from reddit like you and i both did and also mostly for the same reasons. most of them went to lemmy.world because it was the first search result on the big search engines like google & bing. those people have turned lemmy.world into a mini reddit and ended up recreating the same problems that reddit has plus more; hence the bot check that you ran into when you signed up.

the original instances of lemmy all have a strong leftist bent; i think of it like if r/politics; r/anarchy/; r/communism; r/socialism; etc. went off and created another social media platform and then started discussing everything like reddit does, but from this perspective. instances is the name given to individual servers and all those servers combined is nicknamed the lemmyverse, or lemmy, for short.

the fediverse is the nickname given to the pubg protocol that's shared between all the platforms that use it like lemmy, mastadon, kbin, threads, bluesky, etc and that means that the conversations from all of those platforms are shared amongst each other so it's possible to be on lemmy and have a conversation with someone on kbin, for example. i stick with lemmy because it's doesn't have any venture capital investors pushing the admins to enshitify it to maximize profits like has been happening to reddit and bluesky; i've been moving from one social media platform to another because of enshitification like reddit's since the 1990s (before it was called social media) so this last part matters to me a lot.

i started off on lemmy.world like most ex-redditors did and discovered that they've duplicated the censorship thing that reddit likes to do with defederations so i switched to lemmy.ml since it doesn't defederate with anybody due to fact they're the primary instance where lemmy development takes place. the federation is what makes lemmy decentralized and when you defederate; you cut yourself off from the rest of the lemmyverse, but lemmy.world and some of the other instances that got most of the ex-redditors like the star trek instance use it to try cut off content and people from the instances that they don't like and that's their right since it's their instance. lemmy is decentralized so trying to cut out people & content only serves to cut yourself off and that's intention behind the fediverse; to make it so that no power tripping mod or ban happy admin can stop the conversation like they do on reddit.

everything is done by volunteers and donations and, if you don't like one instance; you can move onto any other one and still get a similar experience. i don't like letting other people decide what i can & can't see and who i can & can't talk to so i mostly stick to the instances that don't defederate with anybody like lemmy.ml and i use the block-people and block-communities features when i feel like i need them for myself.

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this post was submitted on 19 Nov 2024
141 points (84.4% liked)

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