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"Maybe when Canada is fed up with the Cons, they'll vote us in!"
Shortsighted buffoons
Dang welcome to Trump's Canada I guess. Scary times boys
How would a Conservative government be equivalent to Trump's Canada? I don't really understand the alarmism. This government was already on it's last days, and there's always going to be a point in time where things must get worse to get better. Waiting 10 months to expect a different result other than a Conservative majority is just copium, and Trudeau had the option of not calling a snap election in 2021 too.
I think Pierre will be easily bought out and let Trump have his way. Fresh water will be piped to the states during his tenure, and he will try to gaslight us into thinking it's a good deal, that's my prediction
All governments everywhere frame their decisions in a way that is akin to gaslighting. If the majority of Canadians disapprove of Pierre's actions, or we lose the trade war with the US in a meaningful way that deteriorates our standard of living, then they will lose the next election. It's that simple.
People blame Trudeau now for all of their ills, as though that he has the power to magically make the economy go up and down with a snap of his fingers. The Liberals made investments in key sectors all the time, including housing starts, climate change and social justice, many of which are never going to be meaningfully acknowledged by people that debate politics online. Pierre is ultimately subject to the same political pressures.
I agree with you mostly except I'm pretty afraid of Trump and I fear irreversible damage in the next 4 years. If Trump wasn't in office I wouldn't be overly concerned about a CPC majority
"The Liberals don't deserve another chance,"
And Conservatives shouldn't even get a chance, yet Singh is handing them power on a silver plate.
Burning down the country and democracy in the West "to own the Libs" sounds like a plan we may never recover from.
The Conservatives will win either way. There's nothing in the next 10 months that would prevent the Conservatives from winning short of PP beating up children.
Voting no confidence now allows the NDP to viably compete for seats like Ottawa Centre where the liberals are weak and rebuild their influence and standing in the house. I don't see why it's the duty of every left-leaning party to prop up the Liberals as the natural governing party. Waiting 10 months isn't going to cause the NDP to sweep into government, it might at best just delay the inevitable if they're lucky, but more likely delaying will catastrophically wipe out their party by making them look like Liberal stage props.
It's about optics.
Canada is one of the last few full democracies out there, and seeing how the United States has already failed, to give up and surrender sends a strong message to other nations that democracy just doesn't work.
So you're saying that if a viable parliamentary democracy is functioning as intended, it has failed?
viable parliamentary democracy is functioning as intended
I guess that depends on your definition of functioning.
Just the other day, the NDP leader said this: "We’re not going to vote in favour of any of their games because that’s what (the Conservatives are) doing. They’re playing games,” Singh told reporters after the vote was tallied. (SOURCE)
And now he wants to play games with our future by handing Conservatives more power?
We all know that the Conservative party in Canada and the Republicans in the US are not acting in good faith to bring benefit to the people, so is this how our democracy is supposed to work?
We have a democracy FOR THE PEOPLE, and if the people aren't benefiting from these "games", then it's not functioning as intended.
In my opinion, of course.
Democracy's success isn't measured by how one person feels about an incoming government - it's based on the strength of democratic institutions, and liberal democracies are further characterized by strong civil societies and human rights regimes. If the majority of Canadians want a Conservative government in power - why do you feel that preference shouldn't be accepted?
It doesn't sound like you even want a democracy, you just want a one-party autocracy, given that you feel that people shouldn't be allowed to have fluid political preferences. That's a failure of democracy - a one party state with all decisions made by someone on Lemmy.
I'm not happy about an incoming Conservative majority government either, but my gut reaction isn't to start claiming that democracy in Canada has failed. I'm able to calmly acknowledge that there's a party right now that is probably going to win a plurality of votes and ridings because the majority of voters align with their messaging. That's not a failure of democracy, that's a success of democracy.
I don't see why it's the duty of every left-leaning party to prop up the Liberals as the natural governing party.
It's the third party fallacy all over again.
Can this wait until Feb 1? Give Canadians a bit more of a chance to see the US get fucked first.
Parliament doesn't sit until Jan 26, so it won't happen before then.
First sitting on the 27th, to be exact. Source.
Yeah, I'm panicking a lot less now. And depending on the exact rules JT could prorogue it even further.
Somebody in the media mentioned a Liberal leadership election; if he goes that way I'll be "kalm" again.
A Liberal leadership convention would require ~4-5 months. The Liberals would name an interim leader elected by caucus if JT steps down.
Please don’t do it Mr Singh.
~~We're doomed. Probably.~~
Yup, and gov is in vacation until Jan 27th, so when they wil go back to work, Trump in its first week may have already destroyed a couple of things here and there in our economy
Actually, that's a good thing. Parliament blow up before he arrives. The government itself will continue to operate.
Thanks, I thought they were coming back early January and was worried.
Get ready for one of the ugliest campaigns in living memory.
I guess it's PP time...
Yeah, WTF is he thinking? At least wait until October after we've had a chance to put out the Trump fire a bit.
Hopefully it's a bluff to get Trudeau to resign, but that's not really the typical NDP MO.
WTF is he thinking?
For better or worse, he's probably reached the point where he thinks they need to cut all remaining ties to the Liberals, and not be seen as propping them up, formally or otherwise.
And that's worth a PP government? IMO he's lost the plot if that's his entire line of thinking.
I'm torn on this.
On the one hand, I agree that a PP government is a terrible thing.
On the other hand, it's hardly the NDP's job to prop up another political party.
You want a two-party system, then. That's pretty much the only way for parties to never work strategically.
Well, no.
I want a system that's actually designed to support multiple parties. Westminster ain't it.
Somebody's always propping up another party if you're Germany or Norway or Spain, though, or you don't have a government. That's what I mean. We have something like 2.5 parties, so we're not used to it, but it's how it's "supposed" to work.
There's no formal coalition agreement, and I don't see Trudeau scrambling to offer cabinet posts to NDP MPs.
The less formal arrangement they had lasted a pretty long time, all things considered.
But Singh doesn't owe him anything.
Former British colonies are still suffering from the effects of first-past-the-post.
With the Conservatives 20 points ahead in polls, it's definitely for worse.
Yeah, WTF is he thinking? At least wait until October after we've had a chance to put out the Trump fire a bit.
Could it be thay he hopes the conservatives will take the fall for Trump's chaos and be out of power quicker? Thats the only other angle Im seeing here.
WTF is he thinking?
"The Bloc will let me do some performative grand standing. I hope."
I hope so too but it doesn't really seem like a smart move since it'd make their threats seem empty (though actually going through with this isn't smart either...)
Well, memories tend to be short in politics, and even then it's only credibility-damaging if it gets called. If it was the conservatives I'd pretty much just assume it's a bluff.
this post was submitted on 20 Dec 2024
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