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Just baffling
(lemmy.ml)
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this post was submitted on 30 Jun 2025
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Yes, liberals tend to define the entire scope of political economy to a narrow, capitalist viewpoint. That doesn't make it correct. A huge range of viewpoints narrowly occupies the "radical" portion, while an absolute mountain of space comparatively is given to subdivisions of capitalism. It's a deeply silly graph.
I think I get it. Right wing groups like koch Bros and heritage institutes push the left to fracture into very niche small subsets in order to isolate making it hard for those groups to organize and easier to kill them off. Much like how a cheetah separates a young calf from the herd. So what groups are you talking about for your "huge range of viewpoints"
Totally not silly at all to get hyper specific about political ideology. I'm a liberal right center neo cat Audi rhino born a capitalist but transitioned to a socialist somewhere around 1992 when political synergy was at its peak
Nah, it aint that deep. The left wants socialism, the right wants capitalism. There are differences in views among leftists and right-wingers, but the base is in if the principle aspect of the economy should be public, or private.
Not all left want socialism. The political spectrum is not divided by "want socialism / do not want socialism"
But you're right it's not that deep but that's the state of modern leftist. Low information
No, the left want socialism, be it anarchism, marxist socialism, etc. Capitalism is not the "absence of socialism," it's its own thing.
You're confusing people calling right-wing parties like the DNC "left" in the context of USian politics, but that's because the left is fringe, in parties like PSL.
What do you think makes the divide? Why are you so insistent on calling capitalism "left wing?"
Jesus I'm so sick and tired of people parroting this DNC line. Nobody has mentioned the DNC here.
Capitalism is not a defining feature of being left. There is more to being on the left than just socialist ideals
I mentioned the DNC because it seemed like that's what you were going for. It isn't about "ideals," it's about property relations. Capitalism is the status quo, ergo liberalism is right wing.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberalism
Even in America, liberalism is left. And the meme interpreted as the left absolutely stands
None of those claimed liberalism was left wing. Liberalism is the ideological superstructure of capitalism, it supports private property rights above all else. I really think you need to step back for a second and try to see what others are telling you, rather than try to convince people that capitalism is left wing.
Hey what's the title of this Princeton article
https://www.princeton.edu/~starr/articles/articles12/Starr_Center-left-liberalism.html
Anymore of this nonsense I'm just going to post chatgpt references cause I know how you all love that
Incredible, a liberal publication talking about political ideology within the confines of liberalism.
What do you think "left-wing" even means? Why would anyone consider liberalism to be left-wing?
I've been answering a lot of stuff here. How about you tell me what you define it as
I already did. Leftism is about progressing to the next mode of production, it's historically progressive and revolutionary. Rightism is about retaining the current system or trying to go backwards, ie the "good old days." Socialism is left wing, capitalism is right wing. Liberalism is the ideological superstructure of capitalism, ergo it's right wing.
Secondly, you never actually answered me about what it means to be left wing, or why you think capitalism is left wing. You just copied and pastied the first things you googled without engaging with the points made by others here and myself.
Have you heard of cooperatives. Would you categorize a cooperative as a right leaning concept
Melvin, you should listen to Cowbee. You're misinformed, but don't have to stay that way.
It's Marxist theory. Marxism is not a universal theory on the subject. It's one of many lenses. So no he's not correct. It's more nuanced than they're suggesting. Which is misinformation.
Okay, I changed my mind, you're actually a goober. Good luck out there little buddy.
No? Give me something that proves it isn't. I have quoted everything from dictionaries to Princeton to media and all anyone is doing is repeating Marxist theory you're the trumpets of the left. Sorry but it's true
See my comment here.
I have a Marxist PoV, as I am a Marxist-Leninist, but that isn't why liberalism is right-wing. Liberalism is right-wing because it is based on private property rights as the centerpoint, and that is the status quo. Maintaining the current status quo is a right-wing, conservative point of view, while the revolutionary, progressive point of view is in socialized ownership.
The definitions you keep linking are from liberal organizations that are benefited by constraining the window of political economic discussion to the confines of capitalist viewpoints. Often, they rely on the Overton Window, which is about what is considered more progressive or reactionary in a given window by the median opinion, ie if you have 100 people in a room, 3 are communists, 67 are bog-standard liberals, and 30 are conservative liberals, then by the Overton Window, you'd have 50 on the left and 50 on the right, with most liberals on the left. However, this erases the actually increasing momentum for socialism, and hides the fact that 97 people in the room are for the current system plus tweaks, and only 3 are for radical change.
The origin of the terms "left" began in France, when capitalism and liberalism were revolutionary, and monarchism was the status quo. We are far beyond the time when liberalism is capable of being seen as revolutionary, however, most of the world is dominated by private property. It is now socialism that is revolutionary, and it has been so for centuries.
I've provided a more nuanced, thorough, and complete analysis than you have, which is why other users are suggesting you listen to me. I can recommend some good works on political economic theory, if you'd like. There's a difference between nuance, and vibes, and you've relied heavily on vibes over nuance.
Neither left nor right, really, it depends on the context.
Again, though, you never answered me.
Hmmmmm really?
It's being definition ๐
What?