$30,000,000,000 Question: Canada’s F-35 Debate Seems Paralyzed (www.19fortyfive.com)

submitted 1 day ago by Scotty@scribe.disroot.org to c/canada@lemmy.ca

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While 16 F-35 fighters remain contractually committed for delivery starting this year, the full 88-jet procurement is stalled amidst trade friction with the Trump administration.
Rising program costs—now estimated at $30 billion—have reopened the door for Saab’s JAS 39 Gripen E.
The Gripen offers superior industrial benefits, including 12,600 domestic jobs and Arctic-optimized maintenance.
Ottawa must now balance the F-35’s unmatched NORAD interoperability against the Gripen’s economic sovereignty as the aging CF-18 Hornet fleet reaches its structur

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[-] BinzyBoi@piefed.ca 14 points 1 day ago

I will never understand what the hell went through Trudeau's mind when he thought going through with the F-35 deal was a good move.

He literally told Canadians that the Liberals would never go ahead with buying F-35s, and then trapped us into this predicament by going back on his word when it was clear as day how hilariously unreliable the aircraft were.

[-] CanadaPlus@futurology.today 3 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

They're exceptionally reliable, and better than anything else at what they do. He went back on this word because he was actually put into rooms with airforce experts who made that clear, and he didn't expect the US to turn evil at the time.

[-] motogo@feddit.dk 6 points 21 hours ago

Cost Per Flying Hour F-35A: $36,000 - $48,000 USD Gripen E/F: $7,000 - $36,200 USD Difference: ~25-75% cheaper for Gripen (varies by source) Maintenance Hours Per Sortie F-35: 20-25 man-hours Gripen: 6-8 man-hours Difference: Gripen requires ~70% less maintenance labor Operational Availability (Readiness) F-35: 70-75% Gripen: High 90% range Difference: Gripen achieves roughly 2x readiness rate Total Lifecycle Cost (8,000-hour lifespan) F-35: ~$400 million (operations only) Gripen E: ~$180 million (operations only) Difference: F-35 costs ~2.2x more to operate

[-] CanadaPlus@futurology.today 1 points 19 hours ago

Nice. I'm guessing the F-16 would be closer to the F-35?

And then any other stealth aircraft is going to blow both out of the water.

[-] BCsven@lemmy.ca 3 points 21 hours ago

I thought they said the F35s were terriblly expensive to maintain per hour of flying. Things can seem reliable in air if most of their time is on the ground getting replacement parts, and adjustments, but that quickly can lose a war by expenses.

[-] CanadaPlus@futurology.today 2 points 19 hours ago* (last edited 19 hours ago)

Nope, you're probably thinking of the F-22. The F-35 got it back down to reasonable hanger time and care, at the cost of a long, multi-trillion dollar development period.

Per the other commenter the Gripen is a bit cheaper yet, but that's because it's built like a car from the 70's or something. All off-the-shelf parts combined in obvious ways with lots of allowances. The cost of that is it shows up to radar like a 70's car. It's basically just a very different aircraft for doing different things.

[-] anachronist@midwest.social 4 points 23 hours ago* (last edited 23 hours ago)

They're getting blasted out of the air in Iran right now. One confirmed with a second loss possible. How many F-16s has Ukraine lost in combat? I'm not saying the F-16 is a better aircraft than the F-35 but I think it does show that "stealth" isn't all that and an "old" aircraft like the F-16 or (for that matter) Gripen, with a modern sensor and weapons load-out, is actually pretty similar in capability.

[-] CanadaPlus@futurology.today 2 points 22 hours ago* (last edited 22 hours ago)

Then what's dropping all the bombs straight onto Iran, lol?

Meanwhile, Ukraine keeps their F-16s well behind enemy lines fighting cheap drones.

[-] Reannlegge@lemmy.ca 1 points 1 day ago

I understand the whole Norad interoperability, but I truly agree with your thought.

[-] Smaile@lemmy.ca -2 points 1 day ago

Justin was neither competent nor as straight laced as he seemed, quite a few times his admin was caught doing really shady shit, stealing gov money, mispending budgets, giving friends contracts for nothing. so im not going pretend this decision was made with any real thinking in mind.