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this post was submitted on 17 Oct 2023
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Lemmy Shitpost
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Guilty Killing civilians: Hamas, Israeli government.
Guilty of Genocide: Israeli government
People who don't deserve to get killed: Palestine civilians, Israeli civilians.
People who have claims to the land: both Palestine civilians and Israeli civilians (sorry the situation is fucked).
Fascist and helping each other gain power: Hamas, Netanyahu
I don't think it's because of lack of will or lack of trying from the Arab side
So to be clear, what are you saying? Are you saying the genocide is justified?
I would like to see the logic you used to come to that conclusion from my comment
Gladly, thanks for asking. So I started out with my general assumption that genocide is always bad. I figured most people agree with that.
Then I looked at your reply and I was like this person is listing some reasons why the Israeli government is genocideing civilians and I noticed that you lumped Palestinian civilians and Hamas into one group "Arabs". And I thought that was interesting because Arabs is a pretty large group that includes people who are unrelated to the current conflict. I also noticed that you left out one of the major reasons for the genocide which is racism. I'm sure you just forgot to list that as I think it is one of the larger reasons for doing the genocide.
Then I was trying to figure out what your comment was adding to the thread. Were you just unsure if we were aware that Hamas had killed Israeli civilians? No, my original post specified that they did.
So I was very confused as to why you made your post in the first place.
Then I remembered that some people online like the genocideing of Palestine civilians. Some people want it to keep going and for that to happen they need to make the genocide sound justified. They may do this by posting something very similar to what you posted.
Now, I don't know why you made your post, so I asked. I also wanted clarification if you thought the genocide was justified because it seems like something a pro-genocide person might post.
Now that I have written out my process, can I please get you to confirm that you think the genocide of the Palestinian civilians is bad.
It was about nutty as I expected.
I was talking about Arab attempts to drive Jews "to the sea" and remove them from the area completely. You might've seen some of these calls and heard of some of these attempts. If not, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab%E2%80%93Israeli_conflict
I'm surprised someone would take that as a pro genocide stance, but it did take some advanced logic for sure.
I'm somewhat surprised my previous reply where I made fun of you for jumping to that very assumption didn't already clarify how you were wrong. Then again, using sarcasm with someone who clearly misunderstands stuff might have been a bad move. lol
Alright, so I was wrong and a big dumb dumb.
Clearly it should be extremely easy for you to say that the genocide of Palestinian civilians is bad as you were not trying to justify it. But you haven't said it yet. It's been like 2 replies. I get it, it can be hard to keep track of everything in that big brain of yours.
So here it is. I have rolled out the red carpet. I've taken the big L. All that is left is for you reply with "the genocide of Palestinian civilians is bad". Heck you can even copy it from this reply and post it.
Yeah
Well duh. I'm gonna even go a step further and say, get this, genocide bad, in general. Be it Palestinians or anyone else really. Quite a bold statement from me
Eh, it happens. Sometimes our mouths (or fingers) are just faster than our brains. Way faster. Just gotta learn from it.
Good job! That was way harder than it needed to be, but I am glad we finally got there. Cheers!
I hope you don't realize how much of a tool you seemed through this. It might be too much for you
I'm sorry. Your link about the Arab Israeli conflict was helpful and good context.
There are just a lot of pro genocidal racists on social media and they rarely self identify because they know it looks bad.
So when you didn't answer my question directly and redirect to my thought process, I had to become a tool troll until you explicitly clarified your position on genocide.
I understand how my initial question can come off as offensive and I am sorry about that too, but you can't assume what someone's position on things are.
Fair enough
Why are the attacks from Israel considered genocidal, but not those from Palestine?
because Hamas hasn't cut off water to some 2 million people? like, positions of power mean you will end up actually qualifying for things like "committing genocide" much sooner
So Hamas who want to commit genocide but fail at it are not genocidal. But Israel which could easily commit genocide but doesn't do it is genocidal?
Look up the definition. Israel is currently commiting genocide. Not denying that hamas didn't want to, but they aren't in a position to do so and never will be.
Definition of genocide:
The aim of Israel isn't to destroy Palestine or kill all Palestinians. They definitely want to destroy Hamas, maybe they want to take over Gaza. While their tactics are inhumane and kill many Palestinians, I don't see how you could argue their real goal is to kill Palestinian as an ethnicity. Abou 20 % of the citizens in Israel are Palestinian. And they also do not attack the Westbank.
who said Israel doesn't commit genocide? just by numbers, if Hamas had committed genocide Israel would have done so 10 times sooner
Genocide isn't about numbers though. A genocide means your goal is to kill everyone from a certain ethnicity. With currently 20 % of citizens in Israel being Palestinian and no attacks on the Westbank I can't see how you would argue the goal and reason for the war is that Israel wants to kill everyone with Palestinian ethnicity?
West bank settlers are currently just shooting Palestinians while being protected by the government, and no, you actually need to be able to kill the people to call it genocide,
Not effective enough, I'm guessing