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submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by SeventyTwoTrillion@hexbear.net to c/news@hexbear.net

Israel trying to pass the hospital bombing off as Palestine doing it is utterly disgusting and guarantees Netanyahu a spot in the deepest pit of Hell for all eternity, obviously, but do not forget that

a) the only reason why Westerners will believe it is because they want to believe it - they are not being brainwashed and this is not some masterful propaganda being weaved around us to turn kind-hearted people into monsters,

b) no Westerner opinions matter at all. In most Western countries there is no real anti-Israel option to vote for even if they did realize that Israel was a giant factory for crimes against humanity, and Westerners protesting against things in general almost never achieves anything (tens of millions protested for BLM in 2020 and not only did the situation not change, it got worse), and

c) the people whose opinions do matter (both the people in the region, and the leaders who aren't already Zionist compradors) already know that Israel is full of shit and that they just murdered nearly a thousand civilians in a single bomb attack.

It is despair-inducing to think that the genocidal Zionist entity is so brazenly, so smugly getting away with bullshitting this away into a cloud of confusion, as they release their metaphorical squid ink just like they did with the stupid babies story, but the propaganda and the media narrative that they are creating isn't what matters. It cannot address the fundamental contradictions ripping the country, the region, and the world apart any more than masterfully-applied makeup can fix a stab wound. It can merely obfuscate.


If you have evidence of Israeli crimes and atrocities that you wish to preserve, there is a thread here in which to do so.


Sources on the fighting in Palestine against Israel. In general, CW for footage of battles, explosions, dead people, and so on:

UNRWA daily-ish reports on Israel's destruction and siege of Gaza and the West Bank.

English-language Palestinian Marxist-Leninist twitter account. Alt here.
English-language twitter account that collates news (and has automated posting when the person running it goes to sleep).
Arab-language twitter account with videos and images of fighting.
English-language (with some Arab retweets) Twitter account based in Lebanon.
English-language Palestinian Twitter account which reports on news from the Resistance Axis.

English-language PalestineResist telegram channel.

Various sources that are covering the Ukraine conflict are also covering the one in Palestine, like Rybar.


The Country of the Week is still Palestine! Feel free to chime in with books, essays, longform articles, even stories and anecdotes or rants.


Here is the map of the Ukraine conflict, courtesy of Wikipedia.

The weekly update isn't coming because I'm sick and too focussed on the collapse of the Zionist entity.

Links and Stuff


The bulletins site is down.

Examples of Ukrainian Nazis and fascists

Examples of racism/euro-centrism during the Russia-Ukraine conflict

Add to the above list if you can.


Resources For Understanding The War


Defense Politics Asia's youtube channel and their map. Their youtube channel has substantially diminished in quality but the map is still useful.

Moon of Alabama, which tends to have interesting analysis. Avoid the comment section.

Understanding War and the Saker: reactionary sources that have occasional insights on the war.

Alexander Mercouris, who does daily videos on the conflict. While he is a reactionary and surrounds himself with likeminded people, his daily update videos are relatively brainworm-free and good if you don't want to follow Russian telegram channels to get news. He also co-hosts The Duran, which is more explicitly conservative, racist, sexist, transphobic, anti-communist, etc when guests are invited on, but is just about tolerable when it's just the two of them if you want a little more analysis.

On the ground: Patrick Lancaster, an independent and very good journalist reporting in the warzone on the separatists' side.

Unedited videos of Russian/Ukrainian press conferences and speeches.


Telegram Channels

Again, CW for anti-LGBT and racist, sexist, etc speech, as well as combat footage.

Pro-Russian

https://t.me/aleksandr_skif ~ DPR's former Defense Minister and Colonel in the DPR's forces. Russian language.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad ~ A few different pro-Russian people gather frequent content for this channel (~100 posts per day), some socialist, but all socially reactionary. If you can only tolerate using one Russian telegram channel, I would recommend this one.

https://t.me/s/levigodman ~ Does daily update posts.

https://t.me/patricklancasternewstoday ~ Patrick Lancaster's telegram channel.

https://t.me/gonzowarr ~ A big Russian commentator.

https://t.me/rybar ~ One of, if not the, biggest Russian telegram channels focussing on the war out there. Actually quite balanced, maybe even pessimistic about Russia. Produces interesting and useful maps.

https://t.me/epoddubny ~ Russian language.

https://t.me/boris_rozhin ~ Russian language.

https://t.me/mod_russia_en ~ Russian Ministry of Defense. Does daily, if rather bland updates on the number of Ukrainians killed, etc. The figures appear to be approximately accurate; if you want, reduce all numbers by 25% as a 'propaganda tax', if you don't believe them. Does not cover everything, for obvious reasons, and virtually never details Russian losses.

https://t.me/UkraineHumanRightsAbuses ~ Pro-Russian, documents abuses that Ukraine commits.

Pro-Ukraine

Almost every Western media outlet.

https://discord.gg/projectowl ~ Pro-Ukrainian OSINT Discord.

https://t.me/ice_inii ~ Alleged Ukrainian account with a rather cynical take on the entire thing.


Last week's discussion post.


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[-] Parsani@hexbear.net 56 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Final edit: I do not think the two competing videos depict the same event. Still weird how such similar events happened exactly an hour apart. This means that the sequence of events I outlined are a mishmash of two separate things. I don't think the video showing the "flares" is from the hospital bombing.


pepe-silvia time.

From the videos we have seen it appears that several events happened in quick succession.

  1. Rocket salvo from Gaza
  2. Single rocket(?) from Gaza leading to 3
  3. Rocket intercepted/exploded high in the air (MANPAD shot at a plane? or a misfire/failed rocket?)
  4. Flares from an aircraft (??)
  5. Smaller explosion on the ground not at hospital
  6. Large explosion at the hospital
  7. See my edit, it appears there were even more explosions afterwards.

This video from the IDF released last night (which had been circulating before), shows 2, 3, 5, and 6, and afterwards a rocket salvo which I am not sure is actually 1 due to other footage: https://nitter.net/IDF/status/1714403025136017784, this is a similar video to what was shown on AJ Arabic, though without the ending: https://nitter.net/IDF/status/1714442617201586220

Some said this video was reversed, but I do not see any evidence of that, but I also fail to see how this shows a misfired rocket hitting a hospital. Whatever that single rocket was, exploded far above in the air.

Then there is this video, which shows 1, 4, and 6. Oddly, I do not see the first smaller explosion here, and what happens in the sky is clearly not 3 as clearly depicted in the first video. The idea that it is flares from an aircraft would make sense. Also note how the salvo is heading away from the hospital: https://streamable.com/hchxwx (same video without mark-up: https://old.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/17anen6/another_angle_of_the_hospital_explosion/)

Now here's a kicker. The video Israel's twitter posted today is from the same location as the above video (see the building at the edge of the frame), but cropped: https://nitter.net/Israel/status/1714593881801601043 (same video without crop: https://old.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/17an67c/video_by_israels_channel_12_showing_the_moment_of/)

Here, the salvo is coming from the other side of the frame, making it look like it is heading towards the hospital. Looking at the two videos together, it appears that one of these videos has been altered. I am leaning towards the second being the altered video as it is heavily cropped and worse quality than the first.

My own suspicion is that Israel knew Gaza would be firing a salvo, and timed/planned a strike so it could plausibly blame Gaza for killing its own civilians. If we look at how this shapes the media narrative, it has directed attention away from the daily bombings of civilians and infrastructure into a debate about who bombed the hospital. It has allowed Israel to claim that it would never strike a hospital, even though they have been doing that all week, and "confirming" that Gaza launches rockets with civilian infrastructure as a shield. This redirects anger back at Hamas and Gaza shoring up support that Israel seemed to be losing in MSM narratives due to, quite frankly, some of the worst and most sustained war crimes that have happened in my lifetime.

Any thoughts?

Here are questions I am left with:

  • What was 3? Something clearly exploded/disintegrated in the air. But what??
  • What was 4? It doesn't appear to be 3 judging on the videos.
  • What was the smaller explosion? I haven't seen anything on it. It wasn't the UNWRA school was it?
  • What exact time did the hospital strike happen at? It seems that people are arguing one way or another on twitter, and the two competing videos are timestamped an hour apart.... Edit: AJ says 7:30pm ("At least 500 people were killed in an explosion at al-Ahli Arab Hospital in Gaza City at around 7.30pm on Tuesday"), which doesn't match either timestamp.
  • Which video of the two released today is the correct one? Were the rockets heading towards or away from the hospital?
  • What can we make of the images released today of the small crater at the hospital? This thread has one theory: https://nitter.net/FSBRG/status/1714609431877431713

Edit: Here is a full clip the footage from AJ Arabic was from: https://nitter.net/Ted55643099/status/1714538028604019116, which shows even more explosions with timestamps.

edit 2: I have added alternate versions of the two competing videos. Another oddity emerges, one timestamp reads 19:59 and another 18:59. Very confusing...

edit 3: https://hexbear.net/comment/4122102

[-] companero@hexbear.net 40 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

The "misfire" was 1000% a MANPADS missile missing its target (Israeli warplane) and then self-destructing in the air. It makes sense together with the plane popping flares and the JDAM sound before the impact on the hospital.

Hamas tried to shoot down a plane with an Iranian MANPADS, missed, and the Israeli bombs arrived at their targets.

[-] Parsani@hexbear.net 17 points 1 year ago

Can you find similar video of a MANPAD doing this? I know so little about these weapons, I have no idea to say one way or another.

[-] companero@hexbear.net 20 points 1 year ago

The best video I could find is this one where a missile hits its practice target. The explosion matches almost perfectly, even frame-by-frame. Small, bright explosion, followed by spark-like fragments.

According to what I could find online, MANPADS self destruct timers are typically between 14-19 seconds which seems to match the flight time in the video.

[-] fever@hexbear.net 17 points 1 year ago

Couldn't have said it better.

[-] zed_proclaimer@hexbear.net 17 points 1 year ago

The video the IDF released is from August 2022 and is a lie

[-] Parsani@hexbear.net 15 points 1 year ago

IIRC that was a different video they released much earlier and then deleted, not the one I posted. They depict different things

[-] zed_proclaimer@hexbear.net 18 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Oh so they lied the first 4 times but time 5 they are surely not full of it. Ukraine and Israel both get a special power nobody else on earth has, they can lie a thousand times even to their Allies and people still believe them and take them seriously with their claims

[-] Parsani@hexbear.net 12 points 1 year ago

While I don't disagree, I'm leaning towards the video I posted being true as it was also on AJ Arabic from a different angle, but I don't think it is depicting what the IDF are saying.

[-] trompete@hexbear.net 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

BTW I saw that one video without edits on r/CombatFootage. Tried to find a source on Twitter but no luck.

Ok, here's the KESHET 12 NEWS video. They say it's their camera. It's the same camera clearly, but the one they show says 18:59, and the one with the "flares" or whatever says 19:59.

There are also different weather conditions and the camera seems to be panned slightly differently.

Edit: Maybe not the same camera, all the settings on that second video are different, slightly different angle, different zoom, different exposure.

[-] Parsani@hexbear.net 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Good find. I found alternates for both of the competing videos there. Different timestamps...hm

[-] Parsani@hexbear.net 4 points 1 year ago

Take a look at this: https://hexbear.net/comment/4122102

I've watched them several times, and am just more confused than before

[-] appel@whiskers.bim.boats 3 points 1 year ago

Is it possible the bomb was configured to airburst? I thought most bombs were. This would then mean there wouldn't necessarily be a crater right? (Can this be configured by the pilot whilst in flight?, does a JDAM system allow to change the blast height?) Also, I swear no missile can make such a large explosion. There is also no rocket trail leading to the hospital.

this post was submitted on 16 Oct 2023
270 points (100.0% liked)

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