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this post was submitted on 15 Dec 2023
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Israel targets civilians. The vast majority of buildings targeted by Israel since 7 Oct have been "power targets", which, by their own definition, are targets that do not have significant military value but have value in that they can destablise civilian life such that the civilians might put pressure on the government to change.
Israel are literally using violence against civilians to achieve a political goal. That is the very definition of terrorism.
No one can argue that the events of 7 October were not terrorism. Roughly 2,000 people invaded Israel to commit terrorist acts. In response, Israel have committed their own form of terrorism and killed 20,000 people, very few of which were actually members of Hamas.
Your argument is a near perfect example of the pot calling the kettle black.
Israel is using violence against Hamas. Whos goal is to maximize civilian casualties in the hopes of sparking a wider war and gaining more allies than just Quatar, Iran, Hezbolla, Houthis, Iraq, etc...
They want another coordinated Arab state attack, just like the multiple ones that have failed in the past. Over and over, the Arab states have tried to destroy Israel. Hamas is quite clear they will only rest once Israel is destroyed and the Jews killed.
Israel has been forced by Hamas to fight in the densest urban theater immaginable, again, because Hamas wants to maximize Palestian deaths for PR.
Hamas strips protected targets of their legal status by co-locating. This is by intent.l and designed to spark the kind of outrage you see here among posts falling prey to this tactic and supporting terrorists.
I'm not sure what you want Israel to do? Ignore the attack? That hasn't worked for all rockets that have been launched at civilians in Israel. It hasn't worked for all Hamas's suicide bombers ans bus bombings, etc. It arguably encouraged the October attack by allowing them safe haven over and over. I'm curious what they should do instead?
Hamas could end the violence that's killing Palestinians today. Easily. Just stop hiding behind them and surrender. But considering they have 57% support among Gaza residents, and the PR is being effective (just look around worldnews), why would they?
I want Israel to wield their power and superiority in such a way that takes the moral high ground.
Hamas invaded Israel and killed civilians and ransacked their homes.
Israel invaded Gaza, bombing the city and killing civilians before ransacking their (vacant) homes.
Military action should be focused on military objectives. Neither side is doing that, thus both sides should be derided for their actions in this regard. They behave differently, but both share strikingly similar flaws.
Israel are far more capable at ending things right now than Hamas. If Hamas surrendered, Israel could easily come up with some other excuse to keep pressing. If Israel stopped, Hamas would not be in a position to perform another 7 Oct attack. Israel are not defending, they are very clearly on the offensive.
At the end of the day, the real goal here is to expend ordinance and buy more, thus financing the weapons industry. An end won't happen until profit targets are met (assuming the goals don't just get stretched further).
I'm still waiting to hear what you think they should do?
That sounds nice, but there's nothing specific or actionable. It amounts to telling them to "buck up camper" or "just take it on the chin."
Thr military targets operate in civilian places intentionally. Hamas wants as many dead Palestinians as possible.
I'm not trolling, I genuinely reflect on this a lot and wonder myself what other course they have. They've tried ignoring the terroist attacks for ages. Or just some tiny response that does nothing to disrupt Hamas's ability to project terror and war crimes.
If Hamas did and Israel kept going, then they absolutely would be guilty of warcrimes and worse. Without Hamas, there they have no legal basis for the war, and most of their targets would revert to protected status.
I'd be with you shouting for prosecution if that happened. But I definitely disagree with you that that is how it would play out. There is not a lot of point in debating a hypothetical, though.
Ok, to be specific, I would like Israel to focus on military objectives only. Right now, they are deviating far beyond that and extending their rules of engagement, far beyond anything reasonable.
I would also like it if Hamas focused on military objectives. Attacking a music festival with a peace motif is heinous, particularly when it is down the road from a military base.
The Geneva convention already provides scope for dealing with bad actors who use civilian infrastructure for military purposes. Israel exploits this and attacks civilian infrastructure directly, using this exemption as an excuse without proving their postition is valid.
Meanwhile, Hamas completely ignores everything and also attacks civilians directly.
The methods are different, but the end result is the same.