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they keep talking as though we fundamentally want the same things but have different views on how to achieve it. no, i want the amerikkkan state and its allies wiped from the face of the earth and every one of its politicians, media cheerleaders, military brass, etc shot, even the ones who are ok with me being trans! i don't want a "lesser evil". i want the people to assert themselves on the world historical stage and drag you and everyone like you from your comfortable homes. you are the modern incarnation of the Nazis, you are actively carrying out the worst atrocity i have seen in my life, and yet you think you can convince me to do anything for you, let alone not actively work for your overthrow and execution???

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[-] LesbianLiberty@hexbear.net 44 points 8 months ago

Communists didn't obliterate North Korea until one of the most christian nations in the world didn't have a single church standing.

Wait, really? There were that many Christians in the DPRK before the US led genocide? I know the United States intentionally killed 20% of the population and bombed the second most industrialized country in East Asia until there were no buildings taller than one level; but I didn't realize missionaries were that successful.

Good post BTW halal

[-] PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmygrad.ml 39 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

There were and are churches there (with the pause for being bombed to rubble by USA) but they weren't at any point even close to being "christian nation", let alone "one of the most christian nations". There were below 10% of christians in Korea around 1950, and the % in DPRK is even less now, it was below 2% at 2005. Even occupied part of Korea, where there is some 30% christians now is nowhere near to be called "christian nation".

EDIT: there are 5 churches in Pyongyang officially, number similar to large village or small town in let's say Poland.

[-] Ideology@hexbear.net 30 points 8 months ago

I think at its peak Pyongyang was 1/6th Christian. Which isn't a big deal for Euros but in East Asia the missionaries were salivating at those numbers. It was considered a huge success and both sides leveraged that narrative to cast Christians as either oppressed by the evil soviets or bombed to oblivion by their own bretheren.

[-] Ideology@hexbear.net 34 points 8 months ago

Kim Il-Sung himself grew up Presbyterian and dedicated a rebuilt church to his mother after the war. Christianity in Japanese-occupied Korea was actually organized against the empire and was known for sprouting anti-authoritarian movements.

Christian news sources claim there were 3000 churches in North Korea before 1945-1953 (the end dates conveniently change depending on who you ask, but they overlap with wars which tend to be accompanied by human migrations). Pyongyang was supposedly called the "Jerusalem of the East" by contemporaries. All sources agree that after the Korean War there were no churches in the North.

Kim Il-Sung ordered some to be rebuilt, but churches with overt American influence were not allowed to take root. His personal statement on the fall of Christianity in the North was that the people couldn't bear seeing the atrocities committed by fellow Christians. I think it's something in the middle where American missionaries had an incentive to route their flocks to the south to support their fellow Americans, and the believers themselves were simply escaping the egregious American bombing campaigns. The rest is embellishment.

Despite people saying you can't be Christian in North Korea, there are pictures of the churches online. You can go to them. There's a seminary even. So it calls into question the idea of state repression in its entirety because you can refute it with the simple facts in front of your face.

[-] frauddogg@lemmygrad.ml 21 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Those are even really pretty architectural designs; no overwrought gaudy stained glass portraits; no crumbling, moldering brickwork; it's not a fuckin concrete-and-glass megachurch like what Osteen and his ilk would build... This is genuinely lovely and I ain't been an Abrahamic in nearly 2 decades now

this post was submitted on 20 Mar 2024
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