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this post was submitted on 21 Sep 2024
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It’s really funny seeing ppl make the surprised pikachu face about fetterman.
I don’t agree with his reasoning, but I do agree with his assessment that it’s a mistake to push the felon message so hard with trump.
If simply being convicted of a crime makes you a person not worthy of serious consideration in the political sphere, is that implicit endorsement of the legal system? Seems pretty conservative if you ask me.
Even if a person was to believe that our legal system is infallible and that there’s nothing wrong with weaponizing its decisions against one’s enemies, doesn’t bringing up the felony convictions beg the question of what they’re for? That hasn’t been a powerful message for democrats.
I have no love for trump, democrats seem to be messing up here though.
Do you think Trump just made mistakes rather than blatantly committed crimes?
Because Fetterman does. He said as much.
I don’t know about all that but I know trump isn’t a criminal mastermind trying to end America. He is simply an absolute moron.
No one said he was a criminal mastermind. What he is is a convicted felon. And it was entirely of his own doing. It wasn't a mistake to pay off a porn star with campaign funds.
I honestly think it’s more likely that like almost every business, nonprofit and other organization I’ve had any experience with, trump doesn’t have a “proactive” filing regimen.
An old ass accountant I used to work with explained why it’s like this: why give them something to beat you over the head with? Just know the requirements, know the punishment and give the least amount of information you possibly can until compelled.
Of course, larger, richer groups are more able to take that strategy, but that’s a systemic problem.
But it doesn’t matter for the purposes of the crimes in question if it was an “innocent” mistake or purposeful omission.
I think it’s pretty disingenuous for the democrat message to be an attack on trump for simply having been convicted because democrats are at the same time trying to catch lefty and otherwise third party voters who see that criminal justice system as having serious fundamental flaws.
I think getting bogged down in the details of trumps convictions isn’t helpful to the democrats either because explaining them to people makes trump relatable. Nothing he actually did with money was a crime. It was not filing paperwork that was the crime.
The whole thing becomes more akin to having to pay a ticket for a taillight you got fixed because you didn’t bring the receipts to court.
“Your honor, the taillight in question is new, intact and installed on my car”
“Your car isn’t in my courtroom”
“It’s in the parking lot 80 feet to the west of your courtroom. I have a picture of it right here.”
“I will only admit a receipt”
Tbh the conviction rhetoric only appeals to reactionary right wing voters who want to punish people with records or makes him incredibly relatable to normal people.
If anything it seems like a hedge to move towards the right.
I have no idea what you are talking about. Trump was convicted of knowingly paying off Stormy Daniels with campaign funds. He was fully aware of it. There was no mistake.
Yeah I didn’t say that I think it’s a mistake, I said I think it’s not a good idea for the democrats to use the convictions as a lane of attack.
I even said that trump probably systemically doesn’t file paperwork he’s supposed to and that it’s common for people to do that.
Again, not filing paperwork is not the problem here. He paid a porn star hush money with campaign funds. He was fully aware of it. There was no mistake. There was no oversight. Nothing was overlooked. Nothing happened that he didn't know about it. This was a very simple case.
That’s not illegal.
The crime is not reporting it.
It’s reported on a filing. Sometimes electronic but paperwork in spirit.
If the “problem” in your words is the crime, then the problem is paperwork.
The crimes are falsifying business records, not paying hush money.
The hush money was paid by trumps attorney who was then reimbursed with campaign funds. The crime is not paying hush money, the crime is covering it up.
As I said before, I don’t think it’s a very good idea to try to beat trump over the head with the convictions. At best you appeal to reactionary voters who have regressive ideas about crime and justice and at worst you have to reply to questions like “it’s legal to pay hush money out of campaign funds?”
I'm sorry... paying hush money with campaign funds isn't illegal? Are you fucking joking?
Not in the slightest.
My understandings is that the convictions were for not keeping records of what he did, not reporting what he did with the money and trying to cover up what he did with the money, not for what he did with the money.
Falsifying business records are the 34 different counts he was found guilty on.
See all the blue here: https://www.npr.org/2024/05/30/g-s1-1848/trump-hush-money-trial-34-counts
Where do you think the money from those checks came from? It wasn't his personal bank account.
I guess I don’t take your meaning…
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c288wpj1glyo
I must be missing something. It sounds from all the articles you posted that the crime was covering up payments.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but each of the 34 counts refers to a payment made in an attempt to conceal the hush money as legal expenses. If paying hush money were illegal I bet there would be many fewer out of court settlements…
Tell that to the "party of law and order" over there.
Yeah I’m with you. That line of thinking will only attract support from conservatives.
I didn't know why you're getting downvoted. They did polling and focus groups back in July and most people said it wouldn't matter to them unless he got a prison sentence. They just don't see it as serious otherwise, much more like a speeding ticket.