Canada Conservatives Want Chinese EVs Barred and Their Software Banned (eletric-vehicles.com)

submitted 10 hours ago by SamuelRJankis@sh.itjust.works to c/canada@lemmy.ca

30 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Generally avoid posting idiotic things this guy says, but as most people know as offensive as this guy is he's been sure not to offend anyone powerful and it seems like he's finally picked a side. Hopefully this will the straw that break the camel back for the Conservatives.

The Conservative leader called for a ban on Chinese software, matching the US.

“We will protect the North American supply chains by keeping the 75% rule in place, harmonise the North American cybersecurity rules by banning Chinese software, and align with our partners on the tariff against China to counter unfair trade and increase our negotiating leverage,” he stated.

top 30 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old

[-] panda_abyss@lemmy.ca 33 points 7 hours ago

How stupid can you be to say that one foreign country's software is a privacy risk while the one threatening us with annexation's software is all fine and good.

If Chinese software is a problem, all software is a problem, and needs to be regulated as such. I don't give a fuck if it's Ford or byd or VW or Subaru or Hyundai or Range Rover. NONE of them should be legally allowed to deploy tracking software.

[-] maplesaga@lemmy.world -3 points 5 hours ago* (last edited 5 hours ago)

He's likely anticipating a scenario where Canadians beg the US for forgiveness, because car manufacturing is already leaving Canada, and once Cusma ends that will happen to many more things. We are uniquely positioned for pain, and Trump won't let us allow Chinese EV so close to them.

[-] ikidd@lemmy.world 24 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 9 hours ago)

I want a blanket privacy mandate across all vehicles, and if China falls afoul of that, then they can fuck off along with any other of these enshittified manufacturers across the world. This is the opportunity to make that happen.

[-] final_alps@europe.pub 8 points 4 hours ago

That is what we did in Europe mainly through GDPR. And we got rewritten software in Chinese cars. Yes it slowed down the rollout of Chinese cars (or at least their advanced features) but the big brands are now nearing feature parity with the domestic models.

Canada could simply demand the European software. And the European models.

[-] avidamoeba@lemmy.ca 7 points 8 hours ago

That would be best but we're not gonna do that because the moment we hint extra regulation for US autos the lobby activates. The current import carveout is targeted so precisely to displace almost no sales from the Big Three.

[-] JeeBaiChow@lemmy.world 1 points 4 hours ago

Theyre not that difrerent from their southern neighbours, apparently. The conservative part, i mean.

[-] ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace@piefed.ca 26 points 9 hours ago

We NEED cheap small EVs to go pick up our groceries and drop our kids off at school and go to the occasional dinner invitation at your relatives.

Right now all we have are huge expensive or luxury EVs. I want a fucking Honda Fit or Toyota Yaris or a Ford Focus type of car. And the only ones that have them ready to sell are the Chinese.

So let them in and allow us to dump ICE vehicles once and for all.

[-] Ariselas@piefed.ca 11 points 7 hours ago

Fuck ICE in all fields

[-] wieson@feddit.org 2 points 4 hours ago

* heey~~~ * sad german high speed passenger train noises

(Inter city express)

[-] Sturgist@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 hours ago

How often is it running on time with no issues?
Legitimate question, I only took it once from Frankfurt to Cologne, and it was ok once we were onboard, but was massively delayed. Just curious if that was an outlier or a regular thing.

[-] wieson@feddit.org 1 points 40 minutes ago

It's delayed quite often.
Making fun of the DB is its own genre of comedy.

But I have to stand up for them a little bit: obviously one delay is more memorable than 10 arrivals on time.

[-] ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace@piefed.ca 2 points 7 hours ago

Amen brother

[-] BlameThePeacock@lemmy.ca 5 points 9 hours ago

The Nissan Leaf and Kia Niro EV both exist. They aren't quite Honda fit small, but they are compact ev hatchbacks that are nowhere near luxury. Under $50k brand new and do the job just fine.

I've put 140,000km on my Niro EV in the last four years, dragging my kids to sports and driving to work.

[-] Someone@lemmy.ca 18 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 9 hours ago)

$45k+ still isn't what I'd call affordable, especially when their closest ICE equivalents (Nissan Versa and Hyundai Kona) are about $20k cheaper new.

At least it looks like used EVs with triple digit ranges are starting to show up around $10k. The state of EV affordability is improving but there's still a long way to go.

[-] BlameThePeacock@lemmy.ca 2 points 6 hours ago

That's because you are looking only at up front cost rather than total cost of ownership.

A gas car will cost more than $45k in gasoline over its life.

An EV in most parts of Canada will cost less than $10k over the same distance for electricity.

That $45k EVs is already significantly cheaper than an equivalent gas car. This has been true for a while now.

If you drive enough, it can even be cheaper per month while paying for the car. A $600 per month EV payment with $100 a month electrical cost is the same price as a $300 car payment with $400 in gas costs. Then the moment you pay the car off you're saving $300 a month for the rest of its life.

If all you do is commute 10km a day, Yea don't go buy a brand new EV, but you shouldn't be buying a brand new gas car for that either.

[-] Someone@lemmy.ca 2 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago)

The problem is that once you get into lifetime costs the variables go through the roof and any numbers you come up with are almost meaningless to anyone but yourself. (Not to mention needing to calculate increasingly volatile energy prices over decades) I tried to do a bit of basic math. I calculated with BC Hydro home rates at $0.12/kwh and fast charger rates at $0.40/kwh, and with gas at its (local) year low of $1.40/L as well as rounding up to $2/L. I also am taking my basic search for efficiency data at face value.

Cost/100km

Kia Niro EV ~17kwh/100km = $2.04 home $6.80 fast charger
Hyundai Kona ICE ~7.5L/100km combined = $10.50-$15

Nissan Leaf ~18.9kwh/100km = $2.27 home $7.56 fast charger
Nissan Versa ~6.8L/100km = $9.52-$13.60

There's no doubt there are many people saving tons by driving an EV, just as I have no doubt many people will never break even (and if they're ok with that I have no issues).

[-] ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace@piefed.ca 2 points 7 hours ago

Exactly what I was going to reply, thanks.

@BlameThePeacock@lemmy.ca made a good point though. But they're still a tad expensive. But Nissan and Kia (and Hyundai) are on the right track.

Having the Chinese EVs would certainly help with the transition.

[-] humanspiral@lemmy.ca 2 points 5 hours ago

unfortunately, everyone who said they would be making EVs 5 years ago is categorically incompetent at it.Hyundai perhaps excepted.
Polievre's plan would balance more production to Canada and US vs Mexico, but with anti-EV, incompetence, mandate.
EVs are better cars, and Chinese ones provide value. Just as you might enjoy the variety of Mercedez, Ferrari being available to you, you can have a better and practical Chinese car.
National unity (or divisiveness) vs individual freedom are key social questions/values, but ones where we didn't see individual freedom so compromised before. Manufactured divisiveness for unity among supremacists loses on both freedom from collective oppression, and individual consumer choice.
the future of auto industry is far less labour anyway. We should stop pretending local/US profits matter, and stop BS that we must join every US war, including the future one on China. It's a great idea to have open/audited firmware/software with local data security free from all foreign attack vectors, but it is only traitors who would highlight a greater security risk from China than the US.

[-] adespoton@lemmy.ca 15 points 10 hours ago

Why not laws that control data sovereignty? BYD’s vehicles in the EU have to comply with GDPR; all the telemetry goes to an EU data warehouse.

The main issue I have with US vehicles currently is that they collect everything you do, store it in the US, and then both sell data off to third parties AND implement lax security so that interested third parties can just waltz in and take the data. And that’s before you get to the US government buying that data as well.

The only EV I can currently find on the market that lets you turn off telematics is by BMW.

[-] CandleTiger@programming.dev 1 points 37 minutes ago

The only EV I can currently find on the market that lets you turn off telematics is by BMW.

There’s an EV that lets you turn off telematics??? Which BMW is that? How verifiable is it that they’re actually turning off the signal?

[-] SamuelRJankis@sh.itjust.works 7 points 9 hours ago

As usual Pierre is omitting and over simplifying things. Otherwise just going out of his way now to pander to Trump.

https://ici.radio-canada.ca/rci/en/news/2229566/canadians-are-ready-for-chinese-made-autos-but-experts-note-there-are-security-risks

During a recent parliamentary committee hearing, Public Safety Minister Gary Anandasangaree said that Ottawa would ensure "safeguards" are put in place to prevent the vehicles from transmitting information back to China.

There was also discussion to put more Blackberry software in the cars even shipped outside of Canada.

https://eletric-vehicles.com/general/canada-pushes-for-chinese-ev-joint-venture-to-supply-global-markets-minister-says/

The minister revealed there are “active conversations” on how domestic firms might complement new Chinese investment, including with Ottawa-based software developer QNX, owned by BlackBerry.

[-] TribblesBestFriend@startrek.website 15 points 10 hours ago

For the conservatives everything that screw the middle class is worth it

[-] folkrav@lemmy.ca 8 points 9 hours ago

I don't see any reason to trust American software any more than Chinese software at this point. Especially with how deeply involved Palantir is getting at every level, I just can't think of any objective reason to think otherwise.

[-] TheFeatureCreature@lemmy.ca 7 points 9 hours ago

Chinese EVs will have a considerable market presence already by the time the Cons get another shot at government, even longer if they lose again.

Canadians are desperate for affordable EVs so they're going to sell like a hot damn. What are the Cons going to do, tell a huge amount of vehicle owners and buyers in Canada to go to hell? Rhetorical question; of course they are.

Additionally, this is just yet another Con move of trying to cosy up to the US and appease them and their market. Reading the room for even 5 seconds should make it very obvious that Canadians are not interested in that. The US boycott is still going like wildfire.

[-] SamuelRJankis@sh.itjust.works 7 points 10 hours ago

2:51 video with the quote. Time stamp is approx the 90 second mark.

https://youtu.be/cbf8gOMn3TY?t=98

Also to point out this stuff is killer to people who support CBC. This CBC article really dances around the guy trying to kill one of the major Canadian deals with a American opponent. I'd paste quote but the way they frame what the guy said and the words China\Chinese barely attempts to convey anything meaningful in context.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/windsor/poilievre-auto-windsor-9.7129471

[-] SamuelRJankis@sh.itjust.works 7 points 10 hours ago

The Star:

https://archive.ph/yioVS#selection-4281.0-4281.190

The auto plan would also remove the GST from Canadian-made vehicles, end the Liberal government’s electric vehicle subsidies, and ban vehicles that use Chinese or Russian-connected software.

The Canadian Press via CTV:

https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/autos/article/conservative-leader-to-announce-auto-plan-following-meetings-in-michigan/

Poilievre’s plan would also ban vehicles that use Chinese- or Russian-connected software. Additionally, the Conservatives are aiming to create a “harmonized North American cybersecurity and data standard” and ban Chinese vehicles from “proximity to Canadian Forces bases and other sensitive or strategic infrastructure,” a background document outlined.

Globe & Mail and even Post media straight up says he'll ban Chinese vehicles. I won't link either since I also consider them to be shit news sources, but CBC is really doing something ugly here.

[-] SamuelRJankis@sh.itjust.works 2 points 9 hours ago

Probably last update for this but it also makes this insanely outrageous. Even the Conservative website is more straightforward then CBC.

[-] Pistcow@lemmy.world 5 points 9 hours ago

Honestly, I feel safer China having my data (American).

[-] Thedogdrinkscoffee@lemmy.ca 2 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago)

I agree with the conservatives on this one issue. Every argument is legit, but it also applies to the US with even more veracity.

Lets build our own company and make cheap EVs for the canadian market that aren't full of every imaginable dystopian spyware-data-centre-facial-recognition-lock-the-doors-and-auto-drive-you-to-ICE-detention-centres bullshittery.

Fuck me I'd jump on an inexpensive 1970's featured ev in a heartbeat.