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submitted 11 months ago by ksynwa@lemmygrad.ml to c/games@lemmygrad.ml

Nothing frustrates me more than not being able to pause for no seemingly good reason. I'm playing Wild Hearts right now and even though I never play online I cannot pause for some reason. To simulate pausing, I can turn off the xbox and the quick resume feature makes it look like the game was paused when I turn the console back on.

Other games guilty of this are Fromsoft games: Dark Souls, Elden Ring and so on.

Obviously all of these games have an online component. Not allowing pausing when this component is activated makes sense. But if I am playing completely online why cannot I pause? In Soulslike the worst exploit I can think of is switching equipment on the fly but is that really that bad? When stuff comes up in the middle crucial moments it frustrates me a lot.

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[-] redtea@lemmygrad.ml 26 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

I don't play games that don't have a pause button. I'm an adult with adult shit to deal with. That might be as simple as cooking dinner. I don't have long for leisure in the evenings but if I can pause a game in between e.g. cooking, I can play it. If I can't pause, I can't play.

If devs want to say 'fuck you, user, we aren't making our game accessible,' then fuck them, too. Just another symbol of the shit hole that is game development. I don't really care what their justifications are. Online games could be made with a pause button as well if the devs cared about accessibility. It's an industry that takes itself far too seriously, as if games aren't supposed to be a bit of fun. That's what happens when games are commodities, I guess.

It's another factor in gamers being so reactionary; so much of it is de facto the reserve of people without responsibilities or people who don't care about their responsibilities. Down with inaccessible games.

[-] GrainEater@lemmygrad.ml 19 points 11 months ago

In Soulslike the worst exploit I can think of is switching equipment on the fly but is that really that bad

in that case they can implement a pause screen that's only a pause screen, not allowing the user to do anything but unpause ๐Ÿ˜

it's understandable if you're using a game engine that doesn't support it (e.g. your own engine), but I can't think of it as anything other than a design flaw

[-] Amaltheamannen@lemmy.ml 6 points 11 months ago

The basic feature required is to support multiple game states, there's no reason not to have that apart from incompetence.

[-] ProfessorOwl_PhD@hexbear.net 4 points 11 months ago

I'm pretty certain that the Prepare To Die edition of DS1 had seperate pause and inventory buttons, so I don't see why other games wouldn't be able to do it.

[-] lorty@lemmygrad.ml 2 points 11 months ago

That's not the case. You can't pause just as in the remake

[-] ProfessorOwl_PhD@hexbear.net 2 points 11 months ago

Someone elsewhere mentioned that at least one of the games has a mod to add it in, so I must have used that.

[-] ShiningWing@lemmygrad.ml 14 points 11 months ago

in Minecraft

But comrade... MINECRAFT is one of those games that doesn't have pausing...! ๐Ÿ˜จ (In Bedrock anyway, Java Edition is thankfully safe)

[-] lil_tank@lemmygrad.ml 4 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Bedrock is the epitome of Microsoft coming in to ruin shit for everybody

[-] lorty@lemmygrad.ml 14 points 11 months ago

More often than not is a design choice. Dark Souls does it to increase tension: you can't pause to consider your options, you have to do it, and do it fast. It gives an even greater importance to your quick item slots since rummaging through your inventory for an item, while possible, can be cumbersome and kill you.

[-] bjoern_tantau@swg-empire.de 11 points 11 months ago

Star Craft even supports pausing in multiplayer games.

This is one of the few things I hate in Baldur's Gate 3. Sure, the game is round based, but I still can't pause cutscenes. So if my mother barges in while I'm getting it on with Astarion I loose valuable dialogue.

[-] expr@programming.dev 2 points 11 months ago

Huh, now that you mention it that's definitely a nice thing about playing on the steam deck. Just put it to sleep.

[-] lorty@lemmygrad.ml 2 points 11 months ago

That's why I don't mind having to interact for dialogue to advance. It's a simple way to allow for a sort of pause and for people people to read at their pace.

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[-] Alunyanners@lemmygrad.ml 10 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Iโ€™m playing Wild Hearts right now and even though I never play online I cannot pause for some reason.

Funny to see this happen in a Monster Hunter-like. The recent Monster Hunter game (MHRise) allows you to pause in "offline mode"/singleplayer.

As always, the OG Monster Hunter keeps winning ๐Ÿซก ๐Ÿซก

[-] comradecalzone@lemmygrad.ml 5 points 11 months ago

Probably has more to do with the primary target platform being the Switch. I don't think Monster Hunter World allows for pausing, for example.

[-] Alunyanners@lemmygrad.ml 4 points 11 months ago

MHWorld doesn't, but neither does MHRise if you have multiple players ingame.

I don't see a correlation between allowing pausing just because MHR's primary target is switch. I wonder if Monster Hunter 6 (aka MHWilds) will allow pausing in Singleplayer too. (It should, it would be stupid not to after they implemented it in the spin-off game)

[-] comradecalzone@lemmygrad.ml 5 points 11 months ago

The PSP and 3DS titles also had pause. Pause is more likely to be a key feature on "handheld" games since you're more likely to play in "bursts," and the Switch is a handheld" system.

Moreover, as I understand it there are two Monster Hunter dev teams - a primary team that works on the the "mainline" (previously numbered) games that tended to target console, and a secondary "handheld" team that would handle the handheld spinoffs and ports. Rise was developed by the secondary "handheld" team, World and Wilds are being developed by the primary "console" team.

That being said, I'm with you - I like to be able to pause while on a long hunt to go get a drink or take a quick break.

[-] ksynwa@lemmygrad.ml 4 points 11 months ago

I never noticed that in Rise. That's great to know.

[-] Alunyanners@lemmygrad.ml 5 points 11 months ago

Well it is hidden in the game menu. You gotta press start to bring it up, go to the settings(?) tab and there you'll find the option to Pause Game.

I think you can also only do this when you're out hunting too. Makes sense because there's not much that goes on in the Village/Gathering Hub.

[-] 201dberg@lemmygrad.ml 6 points 11 months ago

There's also no real reason to pause for inventory purposes in most MH games due to the way the menu and item swap works. Those games are designed to not need to be paused for that stuff. Or at least, not need it as badly. The pause feature is pretty much entirely for a "I have to step away for a moment" scenario, which is still great they put it in there.

[-] the_post_of_tom_joad@hexbear.net 9 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Uhh you shouldn't have mentioned a fromsoft game. How many skeletons do you have telling you that not having pause is actually cool and great? Lol you're not allowed to not like anything a souls game does online. I mean you can try not to like it, but hoooooo boy are you gonna hear about it.

Btw i think there might be a pause mod for one of the souls games on Nexusmods, have a look!

[-] Addfwyn@lemmygrad.ml 8 points 11 months ago

Souls games just aren't for me. I keep trying them (Demon Souls, Dark Souls, Bloodborne, and Elden RIng so far), and I keep absolutely hating them, more than most anything I have played. There's a myriad of specific reasons I could give, but they simply weren't made for me and that's fine. I have come to terms with the fact that I will never like a From Software game, assuming no significant design philosophy changes.

Interestingly, I have had no issues having that opinion on Lemmy. When I mentioned it back in the Reddit Days, I would usually be downvoted/lambasted with people telling me to just "git gud and I would enjoy it" or the ever-popular "you aren't a real gamer". Or THIS one would make me change my mind.

[-] the_post_of_tom_joad@hexbear.net 4 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Haha! I feel you. I dont get when people put so much of their egos into a hobby where they feel the need to police their fellow hobbyists. Its an old and tiring tale, but one that never ends.

For myself, the souls games tickle my exploration and co-op bug, the former especially in DS1s map. However fromsoft does some dumb crap too, and things i simply don't enjoy. i understand the allure but personally have never enjoyed playing video games with strangers and despite many, many messages telling me the reason they think I'm wrong and dumb, that will never change

[-] ksynwa@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 11 months ago

Sekiro and Elden Ring are my favourite games of all time. Not being able to pause is one of my few issues with them.

[-] toilet_wolf@lemmygrad.ml 7 points 11 months ago

god this gives me flashbacks to a few weeks after elden ring released when I got downvoted into the negative triple digits for daring to criticize the game in r/eldenring lol

[-] Alunyanners@lemmygrad.ml 6 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Btw i think there might be a pause mod for one of the souls games on Nexusmods, have a look!

I tried one for Elden Ring. It basically freezes everyone (including you, but you can still control the camera) and everything in one place, so I guess it's technically a pause.

[-] the_post_of_tom_joad@hexbear.net 5 points 11 months ago

Interesting! I only play elden co-op so Im really loving the seamless mod. Hard to believe i put up with the vanilla way for so long!

[-] Addfwyn@lemmygrad.ml 9 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

I agree, and even in online games if I am playing in a solo context I should be able to pause. That should be a benefit to playing solo, by design. As an example, if I am playing Warframe in a non-public solo game, I should be able to pause.
The souls games are a pretty egregious example as they are, by and large, solo experiences first. I understand there are online elements, though I do not think I got far enough in any of them to even see those elements. Plenty of people do not engage with those elements, and a benefit to that should be the ability to pause something.

I would argue it should also be a feature in multiplayer games where it makes sense. Starcraft is a great example. The solo campaign obviously allows pausing, but so does online competitive play.

I accept that something like a MMO isn't going to allow you to pause, but there's not much that can be done about that. Unless you are engaged in dedicated group content, you can still usually pretty reasonably afk in those games honestly.

I have a friend whose first question when I suggest a game to him is "can I pause it?". He just became a father and while he still enjoys playing games, he isn't going to play anything that he can not pause when his child suddenly needs attention.

[-] Helmic@hexbear.net 7 points 11 months ago

Yeah, all they would need to really do is unqueue you when you pause and disable pausing while someone is trying to connect. These are functions that already exist in these games, so there should be effort put into making a pause button.

[-] AlbigensianGhoul@lemmygrad.ml 6 points 11 months ago

I think it is only this way in Dark Souls because Demon's Souls was very messy and allowed for multiplayer to start even during one specific boss battle. So to keep the whole thing seamless (considering how otherwise janky the game was) they just went with "no pause" and it somehow became a tradition. Sekiro which is offline-only has a pause button AFAIK and you can "pause" Bloodborne by pressing the home button.

I'm not sure if there is ever a design benefit to not allowing pausing, it's mostly from technical difficulties. Monster Hunter is identical to Dark Souls and always had a pause button since at least the Wii version.

[-] robot_dog_with_gun@hexbear.net 6 points 11 months ago

counterpoint: not being able to pause creates tension and puts pressure on the player. that wii U zombie game didn't pause while you were digging around in your inventory and that game would be way less interesting if it did. i probably wouldn't even remember it exists.

if you don't like that tension and pressure that's fine but there's no shortage of games that don't restrict you like that and no-pause is a legitimate design tool.

[-] redtea@lemmygrad.ml 17 points 11 months ago

If there was a pause button and you wanted the tension, all you would have to do is simply not press pause.

[-] GarbageShoot@hexbear.net 9 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Whether not having a pause is justified or not, you surely must know this isn't a good response, right? "Just play wildly suboptimally for dramatic effect" is not viable game design.

[-] redtea@lemmygrad.ml 6 points 11 months ago

So not building in a pause button automatically makes gameplay wildly suboptimal?

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[-] Berttheduck@lemmy.ml 3 points 11 months ago

I think my favourite implementation is Dead Space. All the inventory and map are diegetic and the world doesn't pause to use them but the game does still have a pause function. Best of both worlds I think.

[-] Ciel@lemmygrad.ml 4 points 11 months ago

you would be surprised how hard a pause feature can be to implement.

[-] Alunyanners@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 11 months ago

Other games guilty of this are Fromsoft games: Dark Souls, Elden Ring and so on.

I missed this part. A workaround this could be exiting to the main menu when you gotta go afk, as the game will resume where you left it off with enemies dead and all (if you killed them).

Granted, this technique is useless against Boss Fights, where it'll kick you out of the boss fight and make you do it all over again, so...

[-] ksynwa@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 11 months ago

Granted, this technique is useless against Boss Fights

It's still useful if you want to keep your souls

[-] Alunyanners@lemmygrad.ml 4 points 11 months ago

I guess, but why would you enter a boss fight while having a lot of souls [that you may need] anyway?

[-] NOOBMASTER@lemmy.ml 3 points 11 months ago

What's the point of pause function if you can just hit Escape and the game will remained paused that way, while showing you menu.

[-] ksynwa@lemmygrad.ml 5 points 11 months ago

I'm not sure what you mean. Pressing escape in Wild Hearts and Elden Ring shows the menu but doesn't pause the game which is what I am complaining about.

If you are talking about having a distinction between the state where the menu is visible vs the state where the game is paused, having them separate and mutually exclusive in Souls games is desirable because if the game stops while you switch around your inventory then the whole balance of the game will be thrown into disarray.

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this post was submitted on 13 Dec 2023
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