Say it with me friends
Ignorance of the law is no excuse
It worked for Jr. Apparently he was too stupid to collude with Russia, despite his best efforts.
Being too stupid to do it is different from I didn't know. Though both are bad.
The next trump legal argument: "yer honor I'm literally too dumb to commit crimes"
Not only that, but he was definitely informed. White House counsel and other informed professionals were privy to a bunch of meetings where people were talking about these ideas, and they shared their opinions and sometimes got in shouting matches or resigned.
I think Trump's brain genuinely cannot process the concepts of "right" and "wrong" as distinct from whatever he feels like doing, and so you could say: Yes, people whose job it is to be informed experts told him very clearly that these things were illegal, but his brain is so rotten and single-minded that he couldn't absorb that their advice might be objectively true, any more than a dog can understand a "keep off the grass" sign.
Fortunately I think the chance of his lawyers advancing that as a defense is pretty remote.
It boils down to:
No one stopped me in the moment so that means I'm allowed
Like if you tell a child not to touch a hot stove, they touch it, then get mad you didn't stop them.
You always got to think what would a toddler do if you want to understand trump.
Yeah. It's just not a logical frame of mind. If you tried to stop me in the moment, you're the enemy and you must be destroyed, how dare you, I feel angry, fuck you. If I did it and later it turned out it was wrong, you should have stopped me, how dare you, it's not my fault, it's your fault, I feel angry, fuck you.
Ignorance of the law is no excuse
Unless you're a cop illegally detaining someone for breaking a non-existent law
“Our country has a longstanding tradition of forceful political advocacy regarding widespread allegations of fraud and irregularities in a long list of presidential elections throughout our history, therefore, President Trump lacked fair notice that his advocacy in the instance of the 2020 presidential election could be criminalized,” according to his attorneys.
Calling what he did "political advocacy" is a bit like calling what Jeffrey Dahmer did an "alternative diet"....
...lacked fair notice that his advocacy in the instance of the 2020 presidential election could be criminalized
They're trying to insinuate that it was only just made illegal after the fact, like he didn't know that trying to commit election fraud was already a crime.
It's a roundabout way of acknowledging that it's considered uncouth to charge rich people with their crimes.
I swear they're about to take the Hitler defense. Just say, "yeah! We did it! We tried to overthrow the government! But only because we looooooove this country so much... And sure, sure, y'all say we're racist, but it's clear you don't understand just how racist we are. We are waaaaaay more racist than you can even conceive."
Then his idiot followers will talk about how he speaks the truth and says what's on his mind and he'll get locked up for, like, a year, during which time he'll pen his horrible instruction manual on how to destroy our country.
I'm pretty sure everyone in the federal government has had plenty of notice, since the US Constitution grants States the sole authority to operate elections.
Firstly: of course he knew it was illegal.
Secondly: ignorance of the law does not give you immunity from breaking it
Ignorance of the law does not absolve you of the consequences for breaking that law.
Human so morally bankrupt needs minimum notice period before committing crimes otherwise it's unfair to judge him on said crimes.
Right...
Ignorance of the law has never been received in court as a viable defence.
unless youre a police officer.
the only people allowed to be completely ignorant of the law, and get away with it, are police officers.
sure, they are wrong, but whatareyougunnadoaboutit. courts have ruled "police officers do not need to know the law to enforce it" which means they can literally do whatever they want, and you have no choice until later.
awesome.
In general no. Some laws have this written as a specific out though right into them. Not aware if Georgia's laws have anything like this, but Trump Jr not being charged for criminal conduct in his meetings with Russian agents is a pretty famous example:
Mueller declined charging him because "On the facts here, the government would unlikely be able to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the June 9 meeting participants had general knowledge that their conduct was unlawful. The investigation has not developed evidence that the participants in the meeting were familiar with the foreign-contribution ban or the application of federal law to the relevant factual context."
By no means am I saying this should be a valid defense, I don't think it should. As our laws are written though, sometimes being too dumb to know it's illegal might be a defense, at least for some of them.
Edit: this may not be the case, also see replies below.
Mueller dropped the biggest ball in American history with that whole report. He tried his best to deflect responsibility to deal with the situation to Congress and in so doing gave Republicans everything they needed to spin it all as inconsequential. What a fucking coward.
Mueller did exactly what he was legally allowed to do. A DOJ special counsel is not the same thing as an Independent Counsel.
He could not bring any charges himself, only report to the Attorney General or Deputy Attorney General. And he was also legally bound to follow all DOJ policy, which under AG Barr was that the DOJ could not charge a sitting President or even recommend.
What's next? Sovereign citizen bullshit?
Judge, I'm a natural born... what was it... citizen. You cannot charge me for anything. It's true! Just look at the charters! Those, uhm, charters. I was merely traveling through Georgia. You have to let me go right now. Believe me, I know my rights!
Maritime law, folks. They don't want you to know about the - you know we have fantastic maritime laws in this country. Some of the best, maybe better than anyone else. We used to have them at least, but the radical leftists won't tell you about that. When I walk into the courtroom - and these are corrupt places, let me tell you. A lot of people are talking about how unfairly people are treated here, especially if you're the president. And when you're the president you know a thing or two about courtrooms, folks. I start talking about the courts and the law and the maritime law and everyone listening - many of them lawyers, some of which have good genes, very good genes, folks, some of them are Jewish - I hear a lot lawyers are Jewish but I don't know - when I talk about the courts they say "sir! Sir! How do you know so much about courts and law?" I don't know, folks, but maybe it's natural talent. But when you walk into the courtroom and you see the judges and the lawyers and the bailiff out to get you but you also see the tassels on the flag - they're beautiful tassels, folks. One on each corner of the beautiful American flag. Golden, too. Everyone will tell you that I love gold, I have a lot of things painted gold in Mar A Lago. But when you see the tassels you know it has to be maritime law, not the phony, corrupt laws they use in New York, or Georgia, or Colorado. It's gotta be the maritime law. But there's no sailors in the court so you know - we used to have fantastic sailors in this country, they'd sail huge distances on the oceans. Maybe hundreds of miles, very far. Very far folks. They were in the Navy but maybe on other boats, too. But when you don't see them in the courtroom you know they there's no maritime law. But when you see the beautiful gold tassels on the beautiful American flag you know there's supposed to be maritime law happening, but it's not happening, so you know it's all corrupt. It needs to be thrown out. It means I'm exonerated and everyone knows it. A lot of people are saying it. Very smart people.
and that he was never told that what he was doing in the state – where he is charged as part of an alleged racketeering scheme to unlawfully subvert the state’s election results – could be prosecuted
All the murderers on death row are like "that works?!", as they rush to call a lawyer.
Narrator: It does not.
After getting caught in a bank robbery, stealing thousands of dollars and traumatizing bystanders, the robber can just say: "No one gave me a fair notice this was illegal"
Is that pretty much the level of this claim?
I'd be like entering Fast 5 into evidence.
See your honor? The good guys were the robbers! They also love America and occasionally fuck members of their family.
"Hey, I just tried to break into my school principal's room on a weekend to change my exam grade - because, you know, bad grades don't look good on me - BUT WHY IS THIS BEING MADE INTO SUCH A TOPIC ????"
“I didn’t see any sign on the door that said ‘breaking and entering not allowed,’ so how I was I to know?”
Next time that I'm caught speeding, I'll just claim that I didn't know that speeding was illegal. That should work.
This defense doesn't even work in the context of his specific case. He was told by staffers that what he was attempting to do was illegal and he made the phone call anyway. How much "fair notice" do you need to double check that you're not committing a crime when told by people whose job it is to do all of the research for you ahead of time?
Ignorance of the law is not a defense for breaking it, and this should be as damning as a confession of guilt.
Trump: You never told me you'd prosecute me for election interference!
Georgia: You never asked!
I'm pretty certain we know his lawyers told him it was illegal
I'm pretty sure a 5 yr old could have told him it's illegal.
We've been told pretty much forever that ignorance of the law is no defense, so shut the fuck up, Donny.
with all this lack of knowledge it sounds like he shouldn't be in office.
"Can't tell if obviously-criminal things are illegal", and "still thinks he should be president" 🤡
Wait a minute, can this be considered a confession? "Yes, I did it, BUT..." ?
Narcs Prayer (again):
That didn't happen.
And if it did, it wasn't that bad.
And if it was, that's not a big deal.
And if it is, that's not my fault. <——
And if it was, I didn't mean it.
And if I did, you deserved it.
__
These are more of phases or stages of malignant NPD thinking. They can circle and circle and mix around again and again kind of like the ‘5 Stages of Grief’ can do.
He is also claiming presidential immunity. That’s classic narcissistic prayer.
Goddammit. The environments going to shit, 3 people own everything and we're STILL DEALING WITH THIS ASSHOLE! TRUMP IS A BOIL ON US ALL.
Ignorance of the law has always been my excuse, he says from jail
I cannot count the number of times I've seen the phrase, "Ignorance of the law is not a defense."
The "Chappelle's White Friend" defense.
lol. He’s now trying the “officer, I didn’t know I couldn’t do that” defence.
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