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[-] FireRetardant@lemmy.world 49 points 1 year ago

Dictators and war are not unique to capitalism, they are just more profitable under it.

[-] Son_of_dad@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago

Yeah all these things existed long before capitalism

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 year ago

They precede Capitalism, sure, but in our modern world it's easy to draw the line between those and Capitalism. Capitalism is very effective at incentivizing these.

[-] Son_of_dad@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago

Either way, lets eat the rich

[-] doingthestuff@lemmy.world 18 points 1 year ago

I'm not pro-capitalism but I'm curious what flavor of replacement you would choose.

[-] H1jAcK@lemm.ee 6 points 1 year ago

Super capitalism. It's like capitalism, but superer.

[-] SoleInvictus@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago

Socialism. When properly implemented, it has a fair amount in common with capitalism but you keep what you earn, the disabled aren't left to die, and billionaires aren't an option.

[-] Kolrami@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

The only one of these I can see socialism eliminating is unemployment. You can easily have dictators and wars with socialism.

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Let's try Universal Basic Income with proportional representation and lobbying made illegal.

[-] jlou@mastodon.social 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I prefer Georgist economic democracy.

  1. All firms are structured as worker coops
  2. Land and natural resources are collectively owned with revenue derive from common ownership going out as a UBI
  3. Common pools of capital collectivized across multiple worker coops through a system of venture communes.
  4. Public goods and mutual aid institutions funded through some variant of quadratic funding

@memes

[-] Axiochus@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

How are dynamics of violence and power handled? Within such systems I'm always worried about elites, coercion, consolidation. How are binding decisions made, and how do we prevent those powers from bringing about the things mentioned previously?

[-] jlou@mastodon.social 2 points 1 year ago

Worker coops are firms that are democratically worker-controlled. Communes are democratic also.

Unemployment would be less worrying due to the UBI. Worker coops are committed to their workers so have incentives to train them. Also, worker coops prefer to reduce pay during downturns rather than employment.

Trade policy between communes would be set by free agreement. Quadratic funding helps resolve collective action problems such as for defense. Power concentration is severely limited @memes

[-] Axiochus@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

Hmmm, I see. I guess I'm asking about the nonlegal basis of law, or the non-normative basis of norms. Is there good contemporary research about the social dynamics of this at scale? I remember Lenin writing about commune clusters, and there's mention of scaling in Das Kapital volume one.

[-] jlou@mastodon.social 1 points 1 year ago

It was a good question. I am limited in response length because I am on Mastodon.

In terms of social dynamics of a stateless society, The Possibility of Cooperation by the game theorist Michael Taylor uses game theory to argue against the Hobbesian case for the state. Radical Markets by E. Glen Weyl covers how to do common ownership with minimal administration @memes

[-] Axiochus@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

Thank you for the sources! I'll take a look eventually. Since both sources seem to interface with rational choice theory, there's probably a cool post-Homansian social network analysis angle that can be explored. I.e. how the weights & pathways of available choices can be modulated by the types of ties between people. I guess I'd expect entity-level decisions to be shaped by emergent structures, regardless of what their initial state was. So, a co-op could become something else entirely over time, regardless of what it says on the can. It's super neat that my Marxist thought is exploring these areas as well (sorry for the label!).

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[-] jumjummy@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

How about capitalism with the appropriate government controls? Break up monopolies and all anti-competitive practices. Use regulations to actually punish violators (and not with some small fraction of profits gained from that violation). Increasing tax rates for the super wealthy with the right tax shelter penetrating laws.

Sprinkle in some appropriate social policies and safety nets.

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[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 year ago

Socialism. Worker Ownership of the Means of Production. Society run and owned by the Proletariat, for the good of the people, not profits for megacorps and large Capitalists.

[-] Nudding@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

The fact that this is downvoted tells me that American propaganda is still going strong.

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago

I think it's also a symptom of Solarpunk not being explicitly anticapitalist, it's an aesthetic and a goal that liberals can appreciate as they see climate change accelerating, but haven't done the analysis necessary to agree that Capitalism is one of the largest underlying causes of climate change.

[-] jlou@mastodon.social 2 points 1 year ago
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[-] Nudding@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Yeah, we probably should have been working on that 50 years ago. Oh well

[-] Blamemeta@lemm.ee 17 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Dictators, unemployment, and war are not because of capitalism. Do yall think the worlds problems started with the 16th century?

[-] rickyrigatoni@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago

I think you accidentally your first word. Lol.

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Not like it started with capitalism, these 3 have drastically changed under capitalism. Our only hope is that they will change further under techno-feudalism into something less devastating

[-] therealjcdenton@lemmy.zip 13 points 1 year ago

That's not funny, it's just propaganda

Centralization not capitalism is the root cause of many issue and the more we blame capitalism the further we are away from reality.

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago

Capitalism fundamentally has issues with it that cannot be solved via regulation. There is absolutely no reason why it's necessary that there be petite dictators in charge of Production, rather than democratic control.

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this post was submitted on 12 Mar 2024
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