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submitted 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) by radio_free_asgarthr@hexbear.net to c/chapotraphouse@hexbear.net

I wasted 6 hours arguing with a libertarian. But I did succeed in arguing him into submission, where he started accepting that his worldview is wrong. His only defense of himself is that "I haven't read anything about objectivism, I think they might prove property rights and markets there..."

I should probably get a real life.

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[-] JohnBrownsBussy2@hexbear.net 23 points 1 month ago

It is very funny to me that you ran into a libertarian so malformed that they haven't even read Rand. Where they a Rothbardian, a Hoppean, or did they get their political "education" from memes?

[-] radio_free_asgarthr@hexbear.net 24 points 1 month ago

He claimed to be both Rothbardian and Hoppean. While exclusively invoking John Locke's conception of property. Really confidently incoherent.

[-] radio_free_asgarthr@hexbear.net 19 points 1 month ago

probably youtube radicalized. He tried to back his arguments by citing bullshit youtube videos.

[-] Diuretic_Materialism@hexbear.net 19 points 1 month ago

This may come off a little "doomer", and I don't mean it to, but I think we at a point right now where there's really not that many reachable people left in the west. I've noticed over the years that the mean age of actual leftists in the west seems to remain about my age for all the time I've been a leftist. I think we had a surge at a particular point in time when I was around 22 and most of the new "leftists" post that are actually just Succs.

I've sorta just matt-grillin since cuz I don't think the material base to form an actual socialist movement exists in most of the west right now, so I don't waste time trying to convert anyone because the best I can make them is a vaushite. Now, I'm actually MORE optimistic for the future now on a global level but I've accepted there's not gonna be any socialism in my backyard.

[-] radio_free_asgarthr@hexbear.net 10 points 1 month ago

I don't think that I have really fully turned this person around, and I am not advocating people do the same. I think this guys beliefs being so incoherent means that there is a very slim chance he reconsiders things. I am just acknowledging that I wasted 6 hours and trying to hope that it wasn't totally wasted.

[-] Diuretic_Materialism@hexbear.net 17 points 1 month ago

I think that's the opposite conclusion you should come to. If his ideology is an incoherent mess, that's more a sign that he has no interest is forming a coherent ideology and just wants politics to validate his vibes about the world. He will likely always be incoherent because he has no interest in coherence. If anything I've seen more success changing people who could actually articulate some sensible logic to their misguided beliefs, it shows they have some actual interest in logic.

[-] m532@hexbear.net 14 points 1 month ago

Arguing a libertarian into submission is almost impossible, so rat-salute-2

[-] citrussy_capybara@hexbear.net 9 points 1 month ago

“don’t have anything concrete to back any of this up, and refuse to do any reading on the subject, but nothing will stop the regurgitation of unexamined ideas upon the world”
freeze-peach is a disease vector that needs proper precautions, but libs will continue to plaguerat both fancy-rona and fascist ideology

[-] Comp4@hexbear.net 7 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Depends, is this someone you know in real life or at least have some contact with? I totally get trying to engage with people you like or vibe with. Obviously, it’s your time, but I’m not sure it’s worth it to try to convert complete online strangers.

[-] radio_free_asgarthr@hexbear.net 6 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

No, I just couldn't walk away and kept arguing with an internet stranger. So what I originally planned to be just mocking and pointing out an obvious contradiction kept expanding out.

[-] Comp4@hexbear.net 8 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

I’m not opposed to you being on a one-person crusade to change the world for the better, but this seems like one of those cases where you need to be able to choose your battles. If this whole thing brought you some degree of joy, it’s not too bad, I guess?

I’m actually expanding on this. I have a social media account that I just use to post about hobbies and interests—nothing else. Even though it's pretty low stakes, I need to remind myself not to waste time on arguments or squabbles. I’d rather spend my time doing something fun than arguing with strangers on the internet.

Sometimes I have a topic I feel strongly enough about to argue, but let’s be real—most of the time, your time is better spent than engaging with "LonedadsforTRUMP2024" in a serious manner.

Either way have a nice weekend egg-dog

[-] radio_free_asgarthr@hexbear.net 6 points 1 month ago

No, I do actually feel that it was a waste of time. I did just keep arguing for the sake of arguing. I just claimed a victory because I got the guy to more or less acknowledge that I am right and he couldn't defend his beliefs. Not rationally worth 6 hours of effort.

[-] Comp4@hexbear.net 6 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Aww, okay, I get that. Well, maybe you can just throw out a zippy one-liner next time and leave it at that? Though I totally get the urge to get in the last word when someone posts something I vehemently disagree with.

this post was submitted on 12 Oct 2024
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