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[-] loaExMachina@sh.itjust.works 153 points 6 days ago

Bringing an army of ghosts to a necromancer's gate might not be the smart move you think it is...

[-] CitizenKong@lemmy.world 16 points 5 days ago

Plus, they were following him very begrudgingly since he was the only one who could lift the curse.

And he also didn’t know that he would march to the Black Gate next.

[-] ArbitraryValue@sh.itjust.works 169 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Their oath bound them in undeath. Once they fulfill their oath, they can't just choose to stick around. They're a single-use consumable item.

Oh and even they can't just walk into Mordor, because Sauron casts Turn Undead as a 20th level Cleric.

[-] Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works 82 points 6 days ago

The reason they're cursed is that they favoured Sauron during the final battle of the 2nd age. That's why Isildur cursed them. So it stands to reason they have some issue standing directly against him.

[-] Allonzee@lemmy.world 5 points 5 days ago

Oh wow, I just took them as cowards/selfish fucks that said not their problem.

[-] Eyedust@sh.itjust.works 4 points 5 days ago

Yep. At first I was agreeing here. Like, why didn't Aragorn specify defeating Sauron is the oath fulfillment? But then I realized that yeah, if they worked under Sauron once, its probably safe to say if they directly faced him at the gates he may have some sort of power over them. Too risky. Send away.

[-] Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works 81 points 6 days ago

At least in the movie they quite literally fought for Gondor. In the books, they just kill some corsairs far away from Minas Tirth.

[-] K4mpfie@feddit.org 40 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Well if I remember correctly these corsairs were attacking the strategically important harbour that also housed all non combatants from Minas Tirth. The Harbour had a low garrison because they went to support Minas Tirith, so by scaring them off Aragon got access to their ships and saved the rearguard. Both strategically important in the context of the war

edit: grammar and fatfingered

[-] Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works 22 points 6 days ago

Oh yeah, the books handle the greater war much more, but that would make for some confusion cinematography. It made a lot of sense, but it's it's also much less... Well, cinematic

[-] K4mpfie@feddit.org 6 points 6 days ago

Yeah I can totally understand why Jackson simplified it

[-] i_am_a_cardboard_box@lemmy.world 43 points 6 days ago

They don't even kill them, they just scare them off their boats using 'fear as a weapon'.

[-] UrukGuy@lemmy.world 5 points 5 days ago

This

The corsairs of umbar flee the boats, the party & rangers take the ships. The whole point of the fleet was to cut off the Dol Amroth reinforcements, which can then join the battle

At Pellenor, they just scare the enemy forces. Once they've fulfilled their oath, they are free.

[-] redhorsejacket@lemmy.world 2 points 5 days ago

Idle thought, not fully staffed: kinda turns the whole "you cannot use the tools of the Enemy, as they are evil in and of themselves and will bring even the most noble low" vibe of the books on its head.

Or, at least, I seem to recall passages to the effect of fear being one of Sauron's chief weapons. Could probably find a lit crit essay on this subject if I went digging.

[-] ochi_chernye@startrek.website 3 points 5 days ago

His chief weapon was surprise, iirc. That's all, just surprise.

[-] NigelFrobisher@aussie.zone 8 points 5 days ago

And their fanatical devotion to the Pope.

[-] palebluethought@lemmy.world 31 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

In the books, I don't believe they kill anyone - or can. They basically just scare off the corsairs so the rest of gondors army can join the main battle. So ops point is kinda moot

E: I guess it's a little ambiguous

Pale swords were drawn; but I know not whether their blades would still bite, for the Dead needed no longer any weapon but fear."

[-] Dasus@lemmy.world 6 points 5 days ago

I don't think that's too ambiguous. I read it exactly the way you put it.

Basically "idk if their weapons work but it doesn't matter they don't need them" so if they don't need the swords one would assume no-one is fighting them and just running like you said.

So I'm just here to second you.

[-] Manifish_Destiny@lemmy.world 7 points 6 days ago

Go watch the extended edition?

[-] Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works 14 points 6 days ago

In the extended edition, they do both (kind of, it's a pretty tiny fleet)

[-] Etterra@discuss.online 18 points 6 days ago
[-] jawa21@lemmy.sdf.org 4 points 5 days ago

It is as if the realms have been forgotten.

[-] Quacksalber@sh.itjust.works 15 points 6 days ago

I mean, the least he could've aak. Those guys seemed to enjoy killing, so maybe they would've liked killing more orcs.

[-] OwlPaste@lemmy.world 23 points 6 days ago

They never specifically killed orks, that's movie stuff. They killed foreign corsairs near the river estuary and fulfilled their oath.

They scared them more than killed them even.

[-] dwindling7373@feddit.it 5 points 6 days ago

They never existed, that's book stuff.

this post was submitted on 29 Jan 2025
354 points (96.8% liked)

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