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this post was submitted on 03 Feb 2024
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Noticed how my passages reinforce my point and yours did not? Consistent message in the NT is that authority is to be obeyed. That to use your mind or assert any dignity for yourself leads to hell. Instead you are to blindly obey. It is about as revolutionary as Stalinism.
Let me clarify something: I am not saying anyone should follow Jesus today. He was a man born over 2000ish years ago, obviously by today's standards it's not revolutionary at all. My only point was that the Jesus movement was radical at the time, which is why he was killed.
Also, what do you mean I didn't address your point? He said anyone who is "with god" can be saved, which contradicted the ruling class at the time. At the time salvation was reserved for the chosen people, essentially a caste system, so no matter how godly or faithful a gentile was they could not be saved. He broke those barriers and that, for the time, was a radical departure from mainstream religious teaching.
Why can't you tell me the year he was born? Also what city was he born in? What was the name of his dad?
In what way? And how do you know that? Because the only sources we have for him on what he supposedly said don't say what you are communicating.
Again. How do you know that? The only sources we have make it out that he was claiming the throne. King of the Jews. Wanting to be a dictator doesn't mean you have bold new ideas about society.
No. There are were multiple Jewish afterlife ideas at the time. Including that there was no afterlife, that there would be an afterlife someday but not now, that there was a vague sleeping like state afterlife, a more traditional heaven-hell afterlife system, and the one Judaism has today with temporary hell. All of this is documented in the works of Pliny, the Talmud, Josphius and you can even see the arguments when Paul was talking about the bodily resurrection in his letters. There is no strain of thought that put the chosen people as the only ones capable of going to heaven even amongst the minority of believers in heaven.
Plus full monotheism wasn't a thing yet for them, that would take another 3 centuries. The Jews had their God, and other tribes had their own.
So where did this idea of only choose people get to go to heaven come from? Christianity. We see James arguing that people have to convert first to Judaism and then become Christians while Paul arguing that you could bypass that step if you were hetro and cis.
If there were a historical Jesus, which again super unlikely, the only idea he invented was ideological purity as a means of salvation over acts of kindness or even just allowing a person to be a freethinker. He invented Stalinism. A society that rewards the ability to echo back the right ideas over character, thought, or merit and what's more he is very blunt about it.
You clearly care a lot more about this than I do, so congratulations! You win, stop crawling up my ass.
Ok?