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this post was submitted on 13 May 2024
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A bunch of nazi's used it as a dog whistle and it got added to a database of hate symbols.
https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-49837898
Why exactly are we giving Nazis the power to poison language, emojis, what have you for the rest of us again?
I think we should do the opposite. As soon as some symbol becomes a dog whistle, we should all rush to use it for it's original meaning as much as possible, thus preventing the dog from hearing the whistle where it's supposed to be used as such.
By that point, it's already been tainted and it's too hard to tell reality from satire from ignorance.
Nazis just love appropriating and poisoning symbols, and it all started with the swastika: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika
In any normal circles, nazis are so irrelevant that you dont need to worry about ok signs or whatnot
First day on the Internet?
No. This was in the context of the original comment. If somebody has no idea what's wrong with the ok sign, they probably don't need to worry about it. This is all terminally online insanity.
Well the purpose of the hate list like this isn't "what symbols not to use" so much as, if a guy uses this and there's context to suggest it's a dogwhistle, this is what it means.
As a concrete example, If someone turns to a camera makes the ok gesture then punches a black guy that can be used as evidence in conjunction with a database like this to add a hate crime charge onto the assault charge.
Exactly this. Gasden Flag, same vibes, same weird arguments from people trying to take it back. Go ahead and try, I wish you well, but you're gonna look like a racist flying it.
Because when someone uses a symbol while they do something shitty, they are associating that symbol with their shitty behaviors. Human brains are wired to identify paterns and associations for threat identification. That's why cops all dress differently than EMT's.
If your ex-girlfriend left you in a nasty break up, you might avoid her favorite restaurant, cry when you hear her favorite songs, or even get upset just seeing a similar car to the one she drove. You cant drown out a dog whistel, all you can do is point it out.
Right but if Nazis just started using the LGBTQ+ flag, that wouldn't be recognized.
They tried that in Reddit back in 2019, and it failed. Frenworld tried taking rainbow flags to mean "A seperate place for every race" ahortly before they got banned.
Once a symbol has stuck, you cant shift it no matter how hard you try.
It was a hypothetical. Pick anything you want.
And anyways you proved my point, the "society" pushed back, ad discarded it, rather than allow it to be poisoned.
No, symbols are just hard to change. Once they have a meaning associated to them, you can't take the meaning away. A pride flag is symbol, so ot means something. An ok hand gesture doesn't have much beyond "ok" to it, so it can quickly be taken over and poisoned.
A drop of poison in a glass will kill you, but a drop in an lake won't harm anyone.
That's why the ok sign is still "in most contexts is entirely innocuous and harmless", even according to the ADL. Because it had, you know, a meaning associated to it ...
That's fine, detach from the flag and pick something else. It's the act of repulsion I'm clarifying. If a group chooses, a poisoner has no power, they are discarded.
"Ok" meant "ok" for many years. Society allowed it to be poisoned and that is lame.
Some random database was poisoned. Nobody in actual society cares.
Tbf the fact that it failed kinda proves his point, and the fact that the ok symbol is "now a nazi dogwhistle" (or, like, that whole "swastika" thing) disproves your second point.
There was already a large, active movement that had adopted the symbol. None such movement existed for the "OK" hand gesture.
Can't tell if you're saying the hindus/other cultures had used the swastika for years and so that's why the nazis were able to steal it (which would seem to be applicable to the pride flag as well, also an established symbol,) or that the nazis were able to adopt the OK symbol because it wasn't well established as a symbol for one group, but rather a general signal for "Ok" since like wwii.
In any case, I doubt it, if that were the reason why wouldn't they have been successful in taking the swastika but not the pride flag, both established symbols? Much more likely that it didn't work "because we didn't let it" which kinda seems to be his entire point imo.
The swastika was not widely used in the western world.
https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-29644591
Probably the same reason that the swastika is a hate symbol instead of a Hindu symbol.
I recently found out how they appropriated the hooked cross symbol. Now I’m streaming angry. I just finished sewing one onto the back of my Jean jacket, too.
Ah. The Pepe Frog Phenomenon.