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Also Democrats: Ve shall round up und eradicate ze undesirables from society!!! Ve shall put zem into ze camps and ve shall enslave them to benefit ze superior class!!!
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this post was submitted on 29 Jun 2024
138 points (92.6% liked)
chapotraphouse
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Comrade they are literally going to do this. They issue a ticket which a person cannot pay, and after so many tickets, incarcerate that person, and then they become slave labor, what's the exaggeration here
I agree, but I also don't feel the need to sugar coat topics to appease liberals in our explicitly leftist space.
As usual we are all correct here
If this is just a space for lefties, we shouldn't get so high on our own supply that we forget how to talk to libs, or the necessity of persuading people to join us.
If this is a lefty space that is frequently visited by non-leftists, and can be used as a way to persuade them, then we shouldn't be staking out the hottest possible take and telling people they should be shot if they disagree.
Hate it to break the news, but to be quite frank, literaly nobody believes this, nobody sees HB like this, certainly if you stick around for long enough you'd have seen the cycles of people coming and going and how discourse changes.
Believe it or not this site used to be quite a bit more in favor of "harm reduction" in 2020. The current trend you see of complete rejection of Biden is not something that came overnight, even if for some that was Oct 7th, for most others 2o20 was already the compromise. Just go back and look at the trauma people here got from Biden's handling of COVID.
That is now part of this site history, "harm reduction" is now a complete and utter shitty joke and a meme as a result.
So as you can see, nobody now visiting this site believes there will be any discourse with people to the right of us like liberal dems. We did that and the Americans here already got burned from it.
We welcome liberals and people further to the right if they're honest about learning and changing, but nobody is under the illusion there is any debate or convincing anyone anymore. We tell Libs can go and eat shit and die, after all its what they told us throughout COVID for example.
I am amenable to this vibe but also its important to demonstrate to reddit brained
that we have actually done more work in developing a politics that has materially worked far greater for far more people than anything they have conceived of. They're here as guests and can ask questions in good faith but assertions are just a stupid thing to do going into any space that is dominated by any ideology
I don't think "well, gee, I know you love the Democrats, and who knows, maybe they had good intentions when they tried to criminalise homelessness" will lead to a mass movement
I'm not saying anything close to that. "Democrats will piss and moan and then go right along with the worst shit Republicans do" is basically the opposite.
Sticking to the actual facts -- Democrats are immediately going along with this horrible thing Republicans did -- does not mean pulling punches, or watering down how shitty Democrats are.
Sticking to the actual facts, both Republicans and Democrats are doing fucked up shit. It's not "Republicans do bad thing" followed by "Democrats follow along"
You don't go "whoops, guess I'll criminalize homelessness now that it's an option"
You don't dilute the bastards' crimes even by 1%, or the liberals will go "see, we may not be perfect, but it was the Republicans who started this! It's not our fault"
You're right, and you're right that we should point that out, too.
What I'm saying is that we should stick to the bad things Democrats actually do, not exaggerate. There is no need to exaggerate because Dems do plenty of horrible shit already, and exaggeration doesn't persuade people who don't already agree with you.
Calling things out for what they are isn't "exaggeration."
Letting liberals dictate the tone in which things are discussed, a tone which has normalized material and political support for genocide in Palestine, is a losing strategy.
Do you not equate imprisonment in the US with enslavement? Like the thing they are being accused of doing is in fact what they are going to be doing. There's no exaggeration here. This is what I'm struggling with.
Say you're right, and there is no difference between going to jail in 2024 and being enslaved on a plantation in 1824 (what "slavery" means to people in the U.S.). Simply saying that does not work.
Here, we aren't even trying "a few lectures or meetings" and then giving up on people, we're shouting a hot take at them and then telling them to fuck off (or worse) if they don't immediately abandon their long-held beliefs. What is the point of reading all this leftist theory if we just ignore it?
But yes, I think there are some significant differences between modern incarceration and the U.S. conception of slavery (antebellum south chattel slavery). That doesn't mean prison conditions are fine, or that it's OK to coerce prisoners into virtually unpaid labor, or anything like that.