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submitted 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) by destructdisc@lemmy.world to c/fuckcars@lemmy.world

And I thought Americans were carbrained, holy shit.

(To be fair, he's not wrong in that this is intended to keep the auto companies and the government nice and fat -- but the obvious response to this is to agitate for better public transit, not railing against an environmentally sound policy.)

The article in question.

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[-] JackbyDev@programming.dev 33 points 1 month ago

I'd be mad if the government forced me to get rid of my working car too. I think a better option would be to do something like not allow new gas cars to be manufactured or registered to people. Like stop issuing license plates for gas cars rather than forcing everyone to get rid of them.

[-] dejpivo@lemmings.world 3 points 1 month ago

Sounds like how the EU is usually doing this. Limit the companies, not the people directly.

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[-] boonhet@sopuli.xyz 27 points 1 month ago

ITT: Some people want OOP's wife and kid to walk to school on what's essentially a highway. Others seem to realize that there might be a reason why OOP's wife needs the car, and given that OOP's done 65000 km in 15 years, he's not exactly doing a whole lot of driving with it.

There's also suggestions of using public transport, but if that even exists for their route, OOP's wife can't exactly just go walk on a bus, she could get gang raped, because this is Delhi.

We're not talking about a big SUV either. It's a tiny little hatchback, the most city-friendly car possible:

The situation sucks for everyone involved. Whereas in the west we're used to it being just a transit availability issue, in parts of the world there's also the safety issue. Yes, the famous gang-rape-set-on-fire-murder case was 13 years ago, but that doesn't mean Delhi is magically safe now. It's still a huge issue.

[-] grrgyle@slrpnk.net 3 points 1 month ago

The has got to be an alternate route that is nicer than that, that's wild.

But I get that sone areas are incredibly car centric and leave you little choice.

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[-] Sylvartas@lemmy.dbzer0.com 25 points 1 month ago

Isn't it true that once a car is built, it's basically better for the environment to drive it until its wheels fall off instead of scrapping it to buy any new one (even electric) though ? He's right that a lot of the time these schemes are thinly veiled auto industry handouts to stimulate the economy, instead of actual environmental regulations.

[-] Tabula_stercore@lemmy.world 13 points 1 month ago

Isn't it true that once a car is built, it's basically better for the environment to drive it until its wheels fall off instead of scrapping it

In terms of global warming; maybe. It depends on many factors when looking at a specific case. Another commenter already put some numbers together.

The environment, however, in this case is Dehli, a city with terrible air quality. Removing an active source of CO2, NOx, heavy metals, etc is good for that environment. Especially human lungs.

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[-] thedbp@feddit.dk 5 points 1 month ago* (last edited 4 weeks ago)

Every 35000 km or 21000 miles a gasoline car going on average 20km/l or 47mpg have produced the same amount of CO2 that it takes to make an electric car.

So if over the lifetime of the car you go less than 35000km you shouldn't be changing it with an electric. Otherwise please do 😁

[-] BassTurd@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago

How long is that offset including charging? I know that EVs are still significant better, but it's not like the moment an EV rolls out that it's carbon emissions stop.

[-] zurohki@aussie.zone 9 points 1 month ago

The thing with EVs is that they get cleaner over time as cheap solar and batteries become a bigger part of the grid and old coal plants age out.

If you buy a diesel today, it'll still be burning diesel in 2045.

[-] PrettyFlyForAFatGuy@feddit.uk 3 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

depends where you are i guess. if you're in a country with a high proportion of the grid being powered by renewables or nuclear then the emissions do become negligable as soon as it's delivered.

France is 70% nuclear plus renewables etc

[-] boonhet@sopuli.xyz 3 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

The environmental break even period for EVs is getting shorter and shorter as the power grids get cleaner and cleaner.

It was a somewhat solid argument against buying new EVs to replace working ICE cars over 10 years ago, but now it's really not.

[-] Nomecks@lemmy.ca 2 points 1 month ago

The break even on carbon emissions from manufacture vs. daily use is somewhere between around 3 and 10 years. Big trucks on the low end.

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[-] Z3k3@lemmy.world 15 points 1 month ago

Sadly 1km is not the dumbest distant i have seen

Back when I walked my kids to school a parent who shared a fence with the school would drive them around a piece of grass the the front of the school and drop them of. The path through the grass was along side their side garden wall and shorter than the road they drove.

Of course it was a huge 4x4 to boot

[-] Skua@kbin.earth 11 points 1 month ago

I used to live next to some folk who would drive 300 metres to the gym

[-] A_norny_mousse@feddit.org 6 points 1 month ago

Yeah, that one always gets me: and then they run 5 miles on a treadmill.

[-] frunch@lemmy.world 4 points 1 month ago

I always thought the equipment should all be hooked up to some sort of generator somehow so that the place could turn all that energy being spent exercising into electricity for the lights etc. There could also be pancakes 🥞

[-] Cypher@lemmy.world 8 points 1 month ago

Human exercise produces so little electricity that it would probably be a net negative to produce everything required for this gimmick.

[-] Natanael@infosec.pub 3 points 1 month ago

You need an exercise bike to produce something like a few hundred watts at most, if you can keep up an intense session. Continous stable power generation will be lower.

And everything which isn't a bike will have much lower peak power generation capacity, and will be less efficient too

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[-] psx_crab@lemmy.zip 3 points 1 month ago

I used to walk 500m round trip to nearby restaurant for lunch, everyone i met will comment on how far that is. Of course, i take it to heart and now drive my 4x4 there.

Nah just kidding, i now ride a bike, often 3.5km round trip for lunch.

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[-] Treczoks@lemmy.world 11 points 1 month ago

Don't complain about 1km school runs until you have tried to do it on foot - in Delhi. Using a car might be the only halfway safe method in that area.

[-] november@lemmy.vg 10 points 1 month ago
[-] ICastFist@programming.dev 9 points 1 month ago

Certainly seems so. From the picture the OOP posted, it doesn't look like there's paved walkways

[-] aesthelete@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago

This dude is the one living in a fool's paradise with infrastructure like that, and I say that as someone living in a fool's paradise with infrastructure only a little better than that.

[-] boonhet@sopuli.xyz 3 points 1 month ago

Honestly if he's done 65000 km in 15 years it may well be that he only uses it to drive routes where you literally can't walk, like this one.

[-] TassieTosser@aussie.zone 3 points 1 month ago

A 5-8kg school bag is insane. What the hell is going on there? Where I live, it's only 2kg.

[-] paranoia@feddit.dk 2 points 1 month ago

Lucky you. I think school bags in many countries, even developed ones are at an abuse level. When I was 12 my bag often weighed 10kg+, no lockers. I had hoped the situation had improved until I spoke to my 20 years younger cousin, it's still the same shit. I believe it is probably a major contributing factor to scoliosis and kyphosis for children and teenagers, but still it persists

[-] A_norny_mousse@feddit.org 4 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

What's this about? Government-mandated to reduce emissions? Switching to electric, or just "better" ICE cars?

AFAIK pollution is a serious problem in India's cities - but people like this guy are going to defend their "personal freedoms" (cleverly masked as economical concern) tooth and nail.

edit: I stand corrected. This is someone being upset about bad policy. Still, the "wife" and "1km", both suggesting this is a secondary vehicle, triggers me. Standard upper middleclass griping.

[-] tetrislife@leminal.space 3 points 1 month ago

Whoa! Cool it.

The mandate isn't from "government". Apparently, the government failed to do much about pollution, so a regulatory body was set up by the courts, which body did some good things (ban diesels) but also some hamhanded things like judge only based on technology age rather than the odometer. Throwing away a ton of steel and manufacturing that has had minimal utilization isn't going to help any.

You should've dissed the people who made scrapping the dedicated bus lane an election issue some years ago. I guess that never made it to the newspapers, and hence wasn't discussed online either.

[-] destructdisc@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago

Government-mandated to reduce emissions?

On the surface, yes. In reality they're just offloading environmental responsibility on to citizens (and making them buy "better" ICE cars so the auto industry gets the profits) instead of improving and expanding public transit to make it easier to get around without a car.

[-] jlh@lemmy.jlh.name 2 points 1 month ago

cash for clunkers without the cash

[-] dillekant@slrpnk.net 2 points 1 month ago

Yeah it's kind of strange policy. It applies only to the city, in the way a congestion charge would be set up (you can drive maybe 20 km off and get fuel), but the government is hard right wing, so they tend to pick solutions which will hurt the rich the least (they already have newer cars and tend to get newer cars as the old ones wear out), and not really mean anything to the poor (they don't have cars at all, so this is all a moot point). The "middle class" as is the example here tend to suffer.

However, the middle class also has basically no solidarity with the poor, so like they'll readily vote for policies which just wreck the poor, and because India is a "cheap labour" country, often the middle classes are sort of like the Petty Bourgeois in that they really hate the poor asking for more rather than punching up. Add that to the whole casteism / racism thing, and I don't really feel bad for Kapil.

The other other thing is that India (Delhi) is somehow extremely pedestrian friendly while also being extremely hostile to pedestrians. Like imagine small walkable communities surrounded by stroads and a "might makes right" approach to driving, and a government which is committed to more roads (keeps the rich and the poors separated), and you have a place where kids might be able to walk to school on their own, or have walking mean near-certain death depending on exactly where they live in relation to the school.

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[-] ArsonButCute@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 1 month ago

Alright, so I'm not a regular here, I'm a Gearhead who lives in an Unfortunately car centric area. I like cars, I think they're neat, I HATE that we need them to commute.

I don't understand why cars are being banned after an arbitrary time limit. 15 years for petrol? Until year I drove a 30 year old petrol Toyota which pulled almost 50MPG on the highway, could have done better with some simple mods but I live in the mountains and needed the power for uphill.

I understand the desire to keep older more polluting vehicles off the road but arbitrarily declaring vehicles EOL because of their age is ridiculous.

Am I missing the point here? I'd appreciate some input because this feels like a bad move all around.

[-] destructdisc@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago

The government's purported logic is that emissions standards from 15 years ago were lax and are much tighter now and therefore vehicles of that age are contributing to pollution. On the face of it that makes sense; Delhi's AQI is one of the worst in the world, and emissions standards here were pretty meh until the 2010s.

In reality it's because the auto industry wants you to buy new cars. That's it. If the government was actually focused on limiting pollution they'd be investing heavily in efficient public transit and walking/biking infrastructure and enforcing things like a congestion tax to push people towards said options, but they're just offloading it on to regular people so they can make a fuckton of money without having to spend any.

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[-] tiramichu@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 month ago
[-] A_norny_mousse@feddit.org 6 points 1 month ago

On the streets of New Delhi this will probably take just as long as walking. Need the AC though.

[-] lost@lemmy.wtf 8 points 1 month ago

I've been to Mumbai, and 1km is fine for us Europeans, but depending on their location, it can be a life-threatening experience due to the intense traffic, pollution and heat.

That sounds really dangerous. Someone should ban fuel there to make it safer.

[-] boonhet@sopuli.xyz 4 points 1 month ago

Unfortunately fuel being burned in other countries is still heating up their environment.

Also idk if you've heard, but India isn't exactly a rich place. A lot of people can't afford EVs. Despite the fact that yes, the Indian market has cheap options available. But my man in the tweet has been nursing a Hyundai i10 for 15 years. He ain't exactly trying to spend money on cars.

The entire policy is designed to hurt poor people that are car dependent (if you look at the photo of the street in his other tweet, you'll see why he isn't walking the 1 kilometer. There's no sidewalk).

If the government also gave him a good public transit option with AC, the fuel ban could easily be justified. As it is now, rich people will buy newer cars and poor people will be criminals, or take on debt they can't afford to get buy newer cars.

[-] destructdisc@lemmy.world 4 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Longer. It takes about 12 minutes to walk 1km. A car in Delhi traffic will take about 20 minutes to cover that during the morning rush hour

[-] scytale@lemmy.zip 3 points 1 month ago

Yeah it’s the heat, pollution, and safety (not sure about sidewalks there though) rather than distance. I used to live in a tropical country and walked just a little over 1km to work. I had to wear a running shirt and change into my actual shirt when I arrived at the office because I’ll be drenched in sweat. I also had to wear a mask because of the pollution.

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this post was submitted on 28 Jun 2025
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