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submitted 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) by DrunkEngineer@lemmy.world to c/aboringdystopia@lemmy.world

Guests report getting billed hundreds of dollars for smoking, based on the readings of an "algorithmic" smoke detector. The sensor manufacturer markets its product as a way for hotels to unlock new revenue streams.

See also: https://www.wsbtv.com/news/local/cobb-county/marietta-hotel-fined-women-hundreds-smoking-they-say-other-activities-tripped-sensors/WPFWFT7INFGOLHR4HSQK7YIOKY/

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[-] dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world 80 points 5 months ago

I have never seen a more clear cut example of a perfect use case for a credit card chargeback.

Fun fact: You can't dispute part of a charge. If you charge this back and win (you probably will) the hotel loses out on everything, for your entire stay. It also stacks up against them and raises their rates the more they get. An even vaguely concerted effort by people who have been ripped off by this would probably get the hotel in question booted from their credit card processor.

I imagine it's damn difficult to run a hotel if you can't accept credit cards. Just saying.

[-] imrighthere@lemmy.ca 46 points 5 months ago

They disputed it with their bank, the bank sided with the hotel because of the sensor report. Just saying.

[-] dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world 24 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Sounds like they also need to find a new bank, then. Or more people need to file — Once banks get wise of a particular scam, they'll start taking a more dim view of it.

[-] SoloCritical@lemmy.world 19 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

STOP USING BANK CARDS TO PAY FOR SHIT.. Credit cards are the way, they are SOOOOOO much easier to deal with than a bank. Also fuck banks.

Edit: a word

[-] AlecSadler@lemmy.blahaj.zone 15 points 5 months ago

Simply put:

If something gets fucked up and you used a debit card, you're the one screwed until it is sorted out (if it is sorted out). Also debit disputes can take 8+ weeks I've heard.

If something is screwed up and you used a credit card, then the bank is on the hook until it is sorted out. And typically they'll credit you the amount until the investigation is complete and it is usually complete within 30 days. I've had chargebacks remain credited simply because the other party never responded.

[-] half_fiction@lemmy.dbzer0.com 14 points 5 months ago

The commenters are saying "bank" but the original article says she disputed with her credit card company so I don't think that's the case here.

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[-] CosmicTurtle0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 15 points 5 months ago

How do you prove to the bank or in a court of law that you didn't do something? The hotel is alleging that their algorithm detected smoking.

Besides setting up a camera which seems to be very invasive, how would you fight this?

[-] despoticruin@lemmy.zip 4 points 5 months ago

The burden of proof that the sensors cannot provide false positives falls on the hotel chain, not the person getting charged. There is also the question of whether the sensors can be triggered by someone else, or an adjacent room.

You fight them by filing a lawsuit for fraudulently charging you.

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[-] ook@discuss.tchncs.de 7 points 5 months ago

Surprise, banks also pull disgusting shit. Who would have thought about that.

[-] InvalidName2@lemmy.zip 11 points 5 months ago

In two different cases where I've disputed part of a charge/order, the credit card company returned the money for the entire order like you said. I was surprised they did that, and didn't realize that was the norm.

On the one hand, I never wanted anything I extra that I didn't deserve. On the other hand, both times this has happened to me, the companies at fault really, really went out of their way to deserve it. Not necessarily scam level deserved it like this hotel's smoke detector scam, but still.

[-] LilB0kChoy@midwest.social 10 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

But when she disputed the charge with her credit card company, they sided with the hotel after it provided the credit card company the same smoke report it sent her.

They tried that. If the credit card denies it you could have a lawyer send a letter threatening legal action but that's all going to be at an extra cost unless you know an attorney or they think they could make enough to o do it on spec.

[-] halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world 4 points 5 months ago

Or you pay monthly for a law service. Those types of letters are exactly what those programs are intended to cover.

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[-] 0x01@lemmy.ml 5 points 5 months ago

Many credit card software providers also charge for the investigation of chargebacks, to the tune of hundreds of dollars, even if the chargeback is reversed.

[-] dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world 8 points 5 months ago

Accumulating a history of chargebacks against you as a merchant, even if the consumer ultimately loses them, also counts against you and will raise your rates. The processors don't like dealing with merchants that they perceive as excessively risky.

I have to deal with this in my business and the whole thing is really a pain in the ass.

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[-] Wispy2891@lemmy.world 46 points 5 months ago
[-] jaybone@lemmy.zip 33 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

lol fuck these people and these hotels. It’s not about not smoking, it’s about charging more money.

[-] jol@discuss.tchncs.de 11 points 5 months ago

How is this a plus for guests wtff

[-] Evotech@lemmy.world 14 points 5 months ago

Devils advocate, I guess the room won’t smell like shit

[-] Dasus@lemmy.world 10 points 5 months ago

Oh it will.

Why would companies who willingly scam you wish to spend money to keep their rooms nice, when they're straight up stealing from their guests?

Have you never watched Hotel Hell?

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[-] skisnow@lemmy.ca 6 points 5 months ago

Another one to add to the list whenever I hear tech lobbyists shout about how unregulated capitalism breeds innovation.

[-] ijedi1234@sh.itjust.works 4 points 5 months ago

I tend to huff arsenic trioxide when I stay at a hotel. Will the hotel smoke detectors fine me for that?

[-] dangling_cat@lemmy.blahaj.zone 40 points 5 months ago

Sounds like an easy lawsuit. Record the entire stay, test different variables like a hair dryer, candle, fan, soldering smoke, medical equipment like nebulizer, steamer, etc. If they fine you, simply find a lawyer and request a $5M settlement fee. Boom, early retirement.

[-] Raiderkev@lemmy.world 38 points 5 months ago

I stayed at a "hotel" in Denver a few years ago. It was advertised as a hotel on Hotels.com, and we booked because we thought it was cool that the unit had a full kitchen and was like a condo. We thought it would be the best of both worlds, hotel amenities and Airbnb style room. We get there, and it's basically an apartment building that they've turned into a hotel. They have no staff on site, and I had to download an app to check in and do a face scan. Super not privacy friendly. Then one day we stayed in and we're having a few drinks and conversing. This was 5 guys. We weren't being beligerant or loud, just talking. It was maybe 4 pm, and not quiet hours. I get a text saying there was a noise complaint. Then we bailed and got another text saying there was a 2nd noise complaint. They threatened us with a $500 fee the 2nd time. I told them we were no longer in the room, so it wasn't us. We later found what we assumed was a bug device that notified them if we went over a certain decibel level.

I never got charged, but I was ready to fight tooth and nail with my credit card company if they did. It was very weird, and I would never book with that company again.

[-] bodilotion@lemmy.world 15 points 5 months ago

Do you happen to have a description of photo of the bug device? Interested to find out whether I am running into a similar situation myself.

[-] Raiderkev@lemmy.world 18 points 5 months ago
[-] SkyezOpen@lemmy.world 22 points 5 months ago

Set a decibel threshold for each device and receive an alert if it is exceeded.

Show guests that their comfort is your top priority and they’ll leave signing your praises.

Yeah getting a shut the fuck up text every 5 minutes makes me real comfortable. Also they literally advertise it as a revenue stream. How fucked.

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[-] UltraGiGaGigantic@lemmy.ml 34 points 5 months ago

Yet another huge win for those who choose to never leave their basements.

I miss my basement.

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[-] wulrus@lemmy.world 32 points 5 months ago

Couldn't that be interpreted as a confession that their air is at least as unsafe as staying with a heavy smoker the whole night, in terms of PM 2.5 and other hazards?

[-] Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 31 points 5 months ago

Sounds like a great way to abuse front desk staff by proxy.

[-] dawcas@scribe.disroot.org 27 points 5 months ago

revenue-generating scheme

Scam. I think the word is scam.

[-] HailSeitan@lemmy.world 17 points 5 months ago

It’s the Hertz AI scam in a different sector. I suspect every major rental company will have a version of this soon, and that none of them will be auditable or appealable.

[-] Fermion@feddit.nl 15 points 5 months ago

Isn't this a textbook candidate for a class action suit?

[-] jaybone@lemmy.zip 10 points 5 months ago

Some lucky lawyers will get rich off of this.

[-] Outsider9042@lemmy.world 7 points 5 months ago

Don’t forget about the lucky customers that might get almost half the fee back.

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[-] 01189998819991197253@infosec.pub 13 points 5 months ago

Wow. That is.... that is some horseshit.

[-] hexdream@lemmy.world 12 points 5 months ago

Anyone got a mirror of the article that is not geoblocked?

[-] Whats_your_reasoning@lemmy.world 12 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Do archive pages work for you? If so, give this a try: https://archive.ph/2uKUX

[-] Rai@lemmy.dbzer0.com 12 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

That was a very annoying read. I could feel the tiktok plug even before it was posted. This sucks, but oh my god I hate the internet now.

[-] Krudler@lemmy.world 7 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

This is the one time I'm gonna be that jagweed and say I liked it. I've never once been on TikTok and I never will. But I was happy to see it in logical and streamlined format. I didn't feel the need to click on anything. Nothing got in the way... no oppressive popups, members-only, ads, etc. How sad is it that as much as you guys are complaining, and you have the right to your opinions, I found it to be one of the cleanest web pages I've seen in months.

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[-] acchariya@lemmy.world 9 points 5 months ago

This is why I preemptively destroy the hotel room.

[-] _stranger_@lemmy.world 4 points 5 months ago

I looked up the sensor and it's max operating temp is only 112F, which is colder than McDonalds coffee. Hell, the hotel hot water tap is probably hotter than that. The hotel blow dryer gets hotter than that...

[-] blimthepixie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 5 months ago

Yet another way your country fucks over it's citizens

[-] qfe0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 5 months ago

Yay! Fraud!

[-] Nusm@peachpie.theatl.social 5 points 5 months ago

I'd hire a lawyer and hit them for reimbursement of the $500 fee, my legal fees, slander for claiming I'm a smoker, punitive damages, and any another other monetary penalty I could think of. I'm sure I could find a lawyer that would be salivating over this.

[-] HugeNerd@lemmy.ca 4 points 5 months ago

I beg the Death Asteroid to rain down on us.

[-] notsosure@sh.itjust.works 4 points 5 months ago

Better refuse to pay the bill unless the item is removed. If they don’t remove it, contact your bank and block the payment.

[-] Confused_Emus@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 points 5 months ago

A lot of hotels will require a card to put on file at check-in. The paper you get after your stay is typically an invoice, not a bill to be paid. They tell you how much they charged you, it's up to you to dispute if you disagree with something.

[-] M0oP0o@mander.xyz 4 points 5 months ago

Ah one step closer to "Fuck you, pay me" business style.

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this post was submitted on 19 Jul 2025
221 points (98.7% liked)

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