submitted 2 weeks ago by culpritus@hexbear.net to c/chapotraphouse@hexbear.net

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Could not find a chart with the breakdown "of them children" for Palestine on Statista.

Experts believe the real death toll in Gaza is at least ~4.4x what this shows, so IOF is more accurately ~40 times worse.

Applying a conservative estimate of four indirect deaths per one direct death to the 37,396 deaths reported, it is not implausible to estimate that up to 186,000 or even more deaths could be attributable to the current conflict in Gaza.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(24)01169-3/fulltext

Using this estimate, the civilian deaths per day average is 497.33 in Gaza.

The UN agency said it verified the details of 8,119 people killed in Gaza from November 2023 to April 2024.

Its analysis found around 44% of verified victims were children and 26% women. The ages most represented among the dead were five to nine-year-olds.

About 80% of victims were killed in residential buildings or similar housing, the agency added.

above quotes from here: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cn5wel11pgdo

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[-] wombat@hexbear.net 17 points 2 weeks ago

all palestinian violence against israel is self-defense.

[-] stink@lemmygrad.ml 4 points 2 weeks ago

All violence against israelis and zionists abroad is also self-defense!

[-] eldavi@lemmy.ml 12 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

i hated that ukraine and project 2025 was used to counter criticisms for the genocide and mostly because their use as virtual signals during the election were obvious propaganda to me, but few others saw through it somehow.

like the american lgbt, the ukrainians were used as culture war cannon fodder and they're victims just as much as we are in the dnc's failed attempt to use us and them together to help the dnc win the election; rather than risking pissing off their donors by taking the popular actions that had broad support from everyone.

[-] Tomboymoder@hexbear.net 3 points 2 weeks ago

We all are on agreement about what is happening in Gaza and no one here acts like the conflict in Ukraine is equivalent or somehow worse like libs do, so posting this in our echo chamber just kind of seems like downplaying the casualties in Ukraine.
12 thousand killed is still terrible, even if it’s not genocide or as severe as in Palestine.

[-] culpritus@hexbear.net 15 points 2 weeks ago

No intent to 'downplay' civilian deaths is contained here. Both conflicts are listed as equally as possible based on the data available. This is only intended to highlight the contradictions of liberal rhetoric with reality regarding these two conflicts.

[-] Tomboymoder@hexbear.net 1 points 2 weeks ago

who is that for tho? the liberals on hexbear?
not trying to speak to your intentions, but it rubs me as the effect of the post.

[-] culpritus@hexbear.net 10 points 2 weeks ago

it is for anyone that wants to argue with liberals based on data and reality, I think there's a few of those here

[-] Awoo@hexbear.net 9 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

The stuff posted on Hexbear is for people to post elsewhere. You don't usually react to the massive amount of other stuff posted on the site that people already know, so why this one?

Yes the deaths in Ukraine are bad. The US shouldn't have couped Ukraine and Britain shouldn't have scuppered peace negotiations and the nato empire shouldn't be preventing all negotiations from ever restarting.

[-] Tomboymoder@hexbear.net 1 points 2 weeks ago

because people here are lowkey weird about Ukraine

[-] Awoo@hexbear.net 8 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

People here do not support Ukraine. They recognise that the war was caused by the coup of Ukraine and the attacks on the russian-ethnicity regions of Ukraine. They recognise that the Minsk agreements were a real solution that Ukraine prevented from working. They recognise that Ukraine wanted to ethnically cleanse Donbas. They recognise that Crimea and Donbas had sincere and real reasons for wanting independence.

People here don't support Ukraine "winning". People don't support Russia invading or "winning" either. What people do support here is peace regardless of what the lines look like on the map as long as it means the death stops. The problem is that the west is disinterested in peace and will not meet at the negotiating table.

The pro-ukraine people which vaguely translates to pro-endless war consider anything that isn't the complete and total destruction of russia as being "weird" or "pro-russia".

[-] GarbageShoot@hexbear.net 5 points 2 weeks ago

It seems like it's just providing a simple resource to argue against those liberals who say that the war in Ukraine is one of extermination or somehow worse than what is happening in Palestine. I once got someone saying Ukraine was 10x worse and, after I showed them a version of the OP, they just said the Holodomor proves that Russia wants to exterminate Ukrainians.

There's nothing wrong with this setting off a little alarm bell in your head, that's a good thing to look out for, but I think it's fine in this case.

[-] CarmineCatboy2@hexbear.net 4 points 2 weeks ago

I understand the heart of what you're saying - we shouldn't belittle the real human suffering that is ongoing in Ukraine amongst the civilian population of Ukraine and the Donbas. But if we refrain from posting these comparisons and stats because we're on Hexbear and most people here are of a left-wing persuasion, what are we going to post?