I would argue its more how much you're a part of the in group. Compared to a man a woman is in the out group. Compared to a white woman a black man is in the out group. The person in the outgroup is just the aggressive one. Gender is only one dimension IMO.
That depends on the make up of the group just as much as the make up of the person
Your white male KKK neighbour isn’t assertive
That's why I generalized it based on the in and out group dynamics.
I am unsure of the point you are trying to make.
Your post focuses on people being in the out group
It comes off as racist/sexist
Compared to a man a woman is in the out group. Compared to a white woman a black man
I'm sorry those statements offend you cause you can't understand the point I'm trying to make Go enjoy some boobies and feel better. Or don't.
You don’t have to apologize, just in the future don’t paint minorities as outsiders
It normalizes hate
Sure good job talking over minorities tho.
I try
When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch.
Unless you're a short man. Then you're just compensating or have Napoleon complex or something.
I’m confused, is this talking about the grillies or the kitchenettes?
Now I need some answers, what's those terms??
The stereotype goes that men grill and women cook. “Grillies” looks like “girlies” at first glance, establishing subversion
Wat?
The joke is they both wore pajamas to work.
Boomer humor/"everything I don't like is woke" humor
Maybe, but I'd like to understand the joke / "joke", if there's anything to understand. It could be just "hurdur, I insulted them by saying gender because they're young" or maybe there really is some kind of reasoning.
What it seems like the "joke" is at:
If you are assertive but a man, wokes will call you aggressive. If you are assertive but a woman, wokes will applaud you.
Or so I understand the underlying logic, can be wrong ofc.
I'm pretty sure the joke is the exact opposite, that the same behavior that's treated as assertive if a man does it is treated as aggressive coming from a woman.
That does sound like a right-winger 🤔 Best guess I've seen so far. Thanks.
It's actually a comic strip by Judy Horacek from 1999 about how assertiveness in women is viewed as aggressive and discouraged, while it is encouraged in men
This must be the worst copied image ever. The mouse pointer is visible, the artists name it cut. Why not just show the whole picture like here https://nla.gov.au/nla.obj-148723203/view ?
Lol
So a man punching someone in the face is just assertive? Never knew that.
It's about whether or not your perceived identity is socially perceived as allowed to have a voice.
A person seen as a woman trying to speak up when ignored is being assertive and showing girl power.
A person seen as a man trying to speak up when ignored is being aggressive and trying to command or control the situation with his testosterone.
Black people get grouped in with men and classified as aggressive, regardless of gender, because racists whites think that blacks who talk are scary.
There’s way more nuance to that, even off the top. Men are absolutely allowed to have a voice as seen by all the male dominated spaces. The big issue is whether you are punching up or down. It’s why conservative comedians are such failures, all their jokes target marginalized people with crass stereotypes and unfounded nonsense, and they leave the stage to continue acting on those ideas.
In those too few spaces where men are actually held accountable then yes, they are seen as aggressive. Part of the issue is that the male idea of “being ignored” these days is completely off-balance and you can see that so starkly in the outrage whenever we aren’t the center of attention in media. And then we get told this and our first reactions are to get extremely defensive, followed by many continuing to be defensive.
Men are not the victims here; we started it and are unwilling or highly resistant to sharing the space we got too comfortable in while women and minorities were left outside.
I recommend trying to transition genders, even if it's just while traveling or on vacation somewhere.
People are WAY more likely to listen to a woman than a man saying the same thing. It's one of the things I've been most grateful for since my social transition. People actually listen to me now (caveat: if they see me as a woman and aren't transphobic).
I agree about conservative comedians.
Who said anything about victims? This is about who is seen as aggressive. That's men and black people. Men are universally seen as the "aggressive" gender in Western society.
Why do you think white women have the stereotype as damsels in distress? They are seen as nonaggressive and helpless.
It sounds very much like mostly live in circles where people would be accepting of who you are, and those people would also be the ones who would make space for and encourage women and minorities.
The comic is referring to how women too often get called “dramatic”, “too sensitive”, or “hysterical” when they are justifiably mad at something. As far as the powerful people in the western world are concerned women are aggressive and disruptive and men are simply standing their ground. The idea is that sure they’re weak and whatever…until they argue with a man in power or not in power but still very insecure about it. Makes it easy to dismiss them when they’re quiet and easy to dismiss them when they’re loud.
The damsel in distress is an old stereotype that helps reinforce that from a time when women weren’t allowed to be anything else(and honestly one can argue that we’re still in that time). Like how trans and/or gay people “didn’t exist” but actually it was more because people in power didn’t want them to be remembered. Of course women weren’t speaking up all that much, even today so many stay quiet when abused because they fear retribution, so obviously something must be wrong with them if they break from the stereotype and actually get mad. Male violence is practically celebrated, though, so it takes so much more for society to say they’ve crossed into aggression.
Consider: rural Florida.
Rural Florida is way less transphobic than a place like Cornell.
I grew up intersex in the former. I arrived at the latter with a beard and transitioned to avoid the wall discrimination that appeared when my boss raped me.
I'd rather be intersex in Florida than anything but a cis white woman at Cornell.
At least the rest of NY isn't nearly as bad as that shithole. Unfortunately Florida seems to have taken a turn as well while I've been up here, and I don't want to end up underwater.
So, again, you’re talking about a highly specific community that is way more likely to be filled with young progressives who are still getting through the edgy teen phase but are also far more likely to come from privileged, white backgrounds. I have never argued that there are places which go opposite to the comic but that’s not how society at large behaves.
How well did you pass in Florida? There’s also the sad fact that people not accepting you will see you as a man and their monkey brains will run with that, especially if you’re bigger and/or have a deeper voice.
I don’t really know how you’ve just somehow missed the entire, long history of oppression and dismissal of women by whatever excuse fits in the moment.
I was very fluid in my gender presentation as a child, and would at times pass as either.
Privileged, white backgrounds are usually the most bigoted, and least welcoming to people like me, so I feel like we're talking past each other here.
I've seen more oppression by women than by men in my lifetime.
You are a big fat fucking liar who is trying to deny women a voice because a black MAN might get overshadowed. Fuck off and die misogynist.
No, I'm a trans woman who was denied a voice until I started presenting as a woman.
I was raped by my boss and no one cared. They called me aggressive and refused to let me even talk until I transitioned.
Now that I'm a woman, people will actually listen to me talk about it, which is a marked improvement, even though it's still the case that no one cares enough to do anything or try to help.
By transitioning I suddenly was able to get people to listen to me, because they will only listen to a woman when the topic is SA/SV.
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