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this post was submitted on 28 Aug 2024
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Common population is getting increasingly worried about negative effects of mass immigration. They are ridiculed, called racists, silenced and also arrested for speaking up. They are held hostage by their own government.
Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable as JFK said.
As an immigrant in Germany, people who don’t support immigrants are not cowed by their government, don’t worry. They love to tell me about it. Maybe if you were an immigrant for a day, you would see things differently as well.
Well, Herr Sellner, perhaps your perspective is slanted. Somehow people still make their opinions heard.
Maybe you should get out some time
Let's focus on data primarily available from Germany’s Federal Criminal Police Office (BKA) and other official sources.
Homicides and Attempted Homicides by Immigrants
2016: According to BKA data, immigrants were suspects in 285 cases of homicide or attempted homicide. This was during a peak year for refugee arrivals. 2017: Immigrants were suspects in 298 cases of homicide or attempted homicide. 2018: The number dropped to 230 cases. 2019: There were 256 cases where immigrants were suspects. 2020: The number was approximately 220 cases.
Sexual Offenses
2016: Immigrants were suspects in approximately 3,400 cases of sexual offenses. 2017: This number increased to around 3,600 cases. 2018: The number remained relatively stable, with about 3,400 cases reported. 2019: There were 3,500 cases. 2020: Around 3,000 cases involved immigrant suspects.
I'mma be honest, I didn't dig statistics for Germany, but I live in Russia where the same migrant hysteria is rampant rn, and saw some numbers from there.
On average, immigrants in Russia commit less crimes per person than native population. The areas in which there are objectively more crimes are migration laws (obviously) and sexual offences. Numbers in other categories are higher by native Russians. And mind you, our migrants come from underdeveloped primarily Muslim countries, too.
With that said, do you have data on the share of crimes committed by native German population and immigrants? Pure numbers mean little without context.
Cites sources, doesn't link them.
Also, does being a suspect mean they are guilty? All somebody has to do is scream rape, point and a non-white, and they are guilty of rape?
As stated previously the source of data is BKA. Here's an example for 2022 that shows exactly what the GPT summary did.
https://www.bka.de/SharedDocs/Downloads/DE/Publikationen/JahresberichteUndLagebilder/KriminalitaetImKontextVonZuwanderung/KriminalitaetImKontextVonZuwanderung_2022.html?nn=62336
I am not sure what you are trying to tell with these numbers except to stir some hatred.
To make any sort of sense from these numbers, you have a) to define what an immigrant is (hint, the BKA definition is very loose) and b) compare them to the overall cases of the listed offenses.
A. Immigrants were responsible for some murders and rapes and other crimes
B. They had to be present in the country to commit these proximal acts
C. Had they not been present, the murders, rapes, and other crimes perpetrated would not have been committed by them in the country
D. There would have been less crime and the immigration system would not have caused harm to the actual domestic population.
The crime rates of citizens vs immigrants is informative in terms of helping determine policy adjustments in terms of country of origin and specific cultural concerns but it doesn't change the fact that the immigration system is doing harm to the domestic population which it should rightfully otherwise protect and benefit and be sustainable in the service of all it does.
Nobody owes a violent, unstable refugee or criminal migrant (legal/economic, illegal etc) a fox in the henhouse situation. Doesn't matter what they've been thru, it seems like there's not even an in the alternative where they are mitigated and supervised until they can demonstrate they belong or removed before they can take root by causing harm.
Edit: by the way this can actually lead to citizens committing crimes of desperation because they can't find housing or employment or any other necessary. We don't have infinite resources but there is infinite profit potential for those encouraging this mandate.
Housing profits/crisis 🚀 Lower wages/wage growth suppression 🚀 Private healthcare system 🚀
So you want to assign every immigrant a babysitter till they have been evaluated to be no risk?
While we are at it, might just as well give EVERYONE a government sponsored supervisor to be sure, because I've heard even some of those people already here rape, murder or commit other crimes. All in the name of the security of our state. I guess we should form some sort of ministry to supervise this effort. I guess Ministry for State Security might be fitting.
Do you even realize how contemptuous your idea is? I don't know anything about you, but I guess to be sure you won't kill me should you ever visit my city/county/state/planet, I will put you in a cage and point a camera at you.
I hope you keep your idea in mind should you plan to take your next vacation anywhere but your own apartment.
Would you allow any random person who showed up at your doorstep a live-in gig as a nanny without doing some due dilligence? What does high-trust/low-trust mean to you?
Hell no, and I don't care if that person is black, white, blue, has an American, French or Iraqi passport.
But you are trying to build a strawman here, because babysitting is not the same as granting people shelter from hardships.
And to loop back to your previous statements regarding the number of crimes committed by immigrants: Am I statistically more likely to get murdered by an immigrant or by a fellow country man? You might have to reconsider your approach towards high/low threat environments in your everyday life.
Does the aspiration of granting refuge to people facing hardship take precedence over the actual moral and societal imperative to ensure the safety for those you are already responsible for?
There are many people who are facing hardship who we refuse to shelter already and they were always here. And by taking in more people from the outside while refusing existing inside hardship-facers shelter and safety, what is this really accomplishing?
Is that right or fair or even practical?
I guess I might as well argue with a stone instead of an American about universal moral values but here goes nothing:
Wait, did I just judge a person by their membership of a group they got randomly assigned at birth which says nothing about their character?
Anyways...
The suffering of one person is not justification to inflict the same on others. Secondly why are you refusing to help people through hardship in the first place.
Let me ask you in return: Why are neither deserving of your help?
I believe very strongly that the group we are responsible for already should be helped and stabillized before we consider newcomers. I must also point out that mass immigration without regard to the provision of necessaries like plentiful affordable housing, healthcare, good jobs and wage increases, and other finite public resources actually hurts everyone in ways that are profound and difficult to reverse.
There never should have been "we're taking in however many hundred thousand of any demographic (students, asylum seekers, economic immigrants, etc)" unless
Those numbers mean nothing when there is no number to compare it to.
So what are the numbers for Germans?
Immigrants are over 15% of the population, of course they commit crimes. 8% of rapes are reported, wanna bet whether they’re more frequently reported when they’re committed by immigrants?
Apparently the disgraceful rapist pig was a minor when he did it, and she was jailed for a weekend.
Are you defending a rapist because he was young? Seriously?
Judge jails 1 of 9 men in Germany gang rape of teen girl
https://torontosun.com/news/world/judge-jails-1-of-9-men-in-germany-gang-rape-of-teen-girl
...
a lot of drunk women were/are raped by nominally Christian native-born.
...
and this was almost 4 years ago and occurred in a country of 82 million.
You should check your sources.
I found this on your source:
What a weird thing to say.
Edit: lol, 1 day old account
What a bizarre take. What does the age of the account has to do with anything?
It's a common indicator of people making throwaway accounts for the sake of trolling without backlash.
Sometimes genuine accounts may have strong takes, but that's more rare. And the nickname "mods_mum" doesn't make it any more believable.
I ran out of my chat gpt credit but before I did I managed to get a summary of normalized crime statistics for 2005, 2006 and 2007. Once I can query more I'll add data from later years
Here's my ChatGPT query:
https://chatgpt.com/share/337e3463-e232-4bd7-bf08-1d8ed7997740
Oh no... people are starting to trust "AI" to provide them accurate information without verifying it.
"But but but, ChatGPT said it, so it must be right!"
ChatGPT doesn't make up data out of thin air. All crime statistics used are from the BKA. Here's the rest of stats normalized by the population size
Numbers don't even seem to add up, or something strongly changed between 2007 and 2010.
Also, you're either a troll or a very incompetent researcher. You should absolutely never ever rely on LLMs to serve you any factual data. LLMs are highly prone to hallucinations.
Here's an actual paper on the issue: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0167268123001713
Generally, the migrant crime rate increased in 2008-2014, but then decreased throughout 2015-2019. In total, the change averages to about zero.
As per reasoning, two primary forces are demonstrated: on one hand, poorer material conditions, and on the other, the fear of being deported. In 2015-2019, during refugee crisis, being sent back could mean essential death sentence, which shifted the balance. All of this is to say that we should improve material conditions for migrants if we want the crime rates among them to drop further. Instead, it is currently done under threats of deportation.
The only thing left unanswered for me is sexual violence. But in Germany, the difference between natives and locals is not as big as to justify mass measures against an entirety of migrant population.
Uk, then just read this. It's straight from BKA
https://www.bka.de/SharedDocs/Downloads/DE/Publikationen/JahresberichteUndLagebilder/KriminalitaetImKontextVonZuwanderung/KriminalitaetImKontextVonZuwanderung_2022.html?nn=62336
Maybe you should've read it too...
First page:
The number of refugees had also barely risen between 2016 (1.5M at end of refugee "crisis") and 2021 (1.7M), but jumped to 2.8M with 1M coming from Ukraine.
Additionally, the document isn't good as it keeps mixing up "immigrants" and "refugees", so you never know if it's talking about some dude from Spain or a dude from Syria.
Page 38: (can't link to image for some reason with fedia)
I'm also guessing TVZ means something like immigrant or refugee or something?
Solved crime cases against life (murder?)
| year | total | including at least on TVZ | | 2018 | 3007 | 430 (14,3%) | | 2019 | 2751 | 357 (13,0%) | | 2020 | 2947 | 370 (12,6%) | | 2021 | 2635 | 366 (13,9%) | | 2022 | 2732 | 332 (12,2%) |
The number of crimes (and those committed by "TVZ") is dropping despite the number of immigrants/refugees increasing.
Dude, stop using ChatGPT and actually a document by yourself once in a while.
lol getting down-voted for pointing directly to BKA's report. The cope intensifies