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submitted 1 month ago by RubberDuck@lemmy.world to c/games@lemmy.world
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[-] missingno@fedia.io 9 points 1 month ago

Steam has a serious problem with a lack of moderation, which has made it a very attractive platform for fascists. Gamergate never ended, and remember that began with Steve Bannon realizing he could exploit gamer outrage to push propaganda. They keep inventing new scandals to repeat their past success.

One of my favorite games had a very minor patch to revise some cringier elements from early in the game's lifespan. Years later, the forum is still unusuable because it's been colonized by right-wing weirdos with 0.3 hours on record who have dedicated their lives to crying about a game they never cared about pre-patch, because they saw it as an opportunity to push their propaganda.

[-] Kolanaki@pawb.social 7 points 1 month ago

Steam provides the forums; not mods. The developers are supposed to moderate their forums. The only forums I actually see moderated are the Steam specific ones (like the support board). Game specific ones are hit or miss. Most devs just seem to ignore that they even exist.

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[-] Furbag@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago

It does get tiresome going to steam threads and seeing the same copy pasted "don't ruin the game with woke shit" post up voted to the top.

There's a pencil thin line between farming clown emoji and overt bigotry getting pumped to the top of the reviews section by bad faith actors.

[-] ameancow@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

It does get tiresome going to steam threads and seeing the same copy pasted “don’t ruin the game with woke shit” post up voted to the top.

I don't think I've read a steam forum post in close to a decade, and even then it was a very niche thing I was looking for. I have long since stopped feeling any enjoyment or novelty in seeing completely random people's thoughts, since in the last few years particularly, people have no intention to communicate and broadly just want attention, which has become monetized so the problem is far worse than it used to be.

Seriously, at some point we're going to have to accept that the internet is dead or too close to death to be useful for interacting with other humans. I think we all need to stop communicating online on forums and discord and the like, it's all become weaponized and not enough people are left without agendas and campaigns they're trying to push. Let's go back to how we did it for thousands of years and just talk to each other and make real-world friends, leave the assholes and shills and sock-puppets to fight among themselves.

Imagine the power we will have if all the scum and assholes become the inferior population scared to actually do anything or go outside and we become owners of the day and become the ambulatory force towards goals and social progress.

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[-] zecg@lemmy.world 4 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

bigoted reviews posted on games’ Steam pages, which can hugely affect sales for their developers; and Steam curators (self-appointed taste-makers on the platform) directing campaigns against games they perceive to lean left or pursue inclusion.

This fucking shit again. Reviews affect sales? Well, good. You don't get to carefully select a few most-read outlets who'll give you the thumb up. Also, chud curators are "directing" only those who follow them. This argument is about a failing industry that'd like to control what can be said about their products. Make no mistake, Steam's openness in this regard is, for me as a customer at least, added value.

[-] JustAnotherKay@lemmy.world 9 points 1 month ago

To be perfectly honest, the odds of me buying a game are significantly higher if I see reviews about “toxic femininity” or “woke politics”

I use those "wokism tiers" that you usually see from bigoted idiots to check out new games that I'll probably like

[-] Glide@lemmy.ca 3 points 1 month ago

I occasionally go through the lists posted by chud curators for small indie titles that would have escaped my notice. I don't have time to scrutinize every title on Steam, but these guys seemingly have infinite time to ensure every unheard of title with a case of LGBTQ+ representation gets criticism from them. Ironically, they're fantastic for finding small, progressive passion projects I would have otherwise missed.

[-] Paradachshund@lemmy.today 2 points 1 month ago

I agree with that, but negative reviews also affect the algorithm. If enough of those reviews drown out positive ones it will reduce the chance you see the game at all.

[-] rtxn@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

That is literally how I discovered Signalis. It was included in one of those anti-woke curators' "not recommended" list, then I saw that it was an indie title, and overwhelmingly positive... I was sold immediately.

[-] Goatboy@lemmy.today 1 points 1 month ago

You have to be way down the rabbit hole to think Signalis is too woke. Nothing it does would have been out of place in '02 or so.

[-] missingno@fedia.io 1 points 1 month ago

They're not just trying to remove negative reviews for being negative though, this is about bad actors weaponizing the review system to push bigotry. That should not be platformed.

[-] zecg@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago

platformed

That's cutesy newspeak for they should be censored. And wanting to censor them is bigotry, as in "the fact of having and expressing strong, unreasonable beliefs and disliking other people who have different beliefs or a different way of life". The chuds should have been more loved by their mothers, they should have been exposed to culture so they don't become racist assholes, sure. But really, I feel using mealymouthed therapyspeak to remove bigots from sight and pretend they don't exist has been thoroughly attempted and the result is grifters ascend on a ladder of their frustrations to rearrange the society into a chaotic dystopia. Sorry, video games?

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[-] atro_city@fedia.io 3 points 1 month ago

For anybody saying "it's not a problem, just moderate it yourself", look at Relooted's steam forum. There are more than 700 threads there and most of them are really not kind. Tell me how you're going to moderate that.

Just put yourself in the shoes of game publishers or studios that make a game which goes against the grind and gets attacked like Relooted is being attacked. Would you want to employ somebody just to moderate the forums? Should the onus be on the forum owners or should it be on the forum providers (Valve)? Do you think this has no effect on the types of games being released?

I mean, look at this game Tyrone vs Cops 2. Is this OK? What do you think the forum discussions look like. Are they OK? If it's only devs that should moderate their forums, that means the KKK could make game about water lillies and then have their forums be the meeting ground for white power discussions. They won't be offended after-all. That's OK?

[-] SoleInvictus@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 1 month ago

For anyone else not familiar, here's the first line of Relooted's description:

Reclaim real African artifacts from Western museums in this Africanfuturist heist game.

The forum is full of exactly what you'd expect.

[-] doublah@sopuli.xyz 1 points 1 month ago

I mean, look at this game Tyrone vs Cops 2. Is this OK?

It's probably filled with vile stuff, so I simply won't go there. There's awful stuff to be found everywhere on the internet if you seek it out, you can just not go there.

[-] atro_city@fedia.io 1 points 1 month ago

Sure, I won't travel to Gaza and say "wow, so many dead people here" and act surprised, but if I stumble upon a dead body on a playground, you betcha it's at least a little surprising.

[-] grueling_spool@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 month ago

For anybody saying "it's not a problem, just moderate it yourself"

I'm of the opposite opinion. It's a much bigger problem than just Steam community moderation and it needs to be addressed more broadly. (Monkey's paw curls)

[-] missingno@fedia.io 1 points 1 month ago

The reason it got this bad was because they didn't nip it in the bud sooner. If they had been more proactive from the start, there wouldn't be 700+ threads.

At this point, just nuke them all and ban everyone who made a bigoted troll thread. It's gonna be a game of whack-a-mole for a little while, but once you start handing out bans, the trolling will start die down.

[-] FarceOfWill@infosec.pub 1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Compare this to fedi, shared block lists for admins helps a lot.

Should each game have to clean their forum individually?

[-] femtek@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 month ago

Stems need a better tools to moderate. It's a pain to manually go thru.

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and we don’t try to moderate reviews based on accuracy

Than, it's not a review, it's a social media feed. Calling that a review would imply that it must have passed some check. If there is none, it's a post, on a social media. Even than they'd try to moderate that if they cared.

Removing reviews, the response claimed, could be seen as “censorship”.

Fact checkig and moderation isn't censorship, it's moderation.

Recourse for developers is limited. Some are looking into their own security, shoring up protections for developers on their team against being doxxed or hacked by trolls. Or, in the case of the developers of Caves of Qud, paying their own moderators to handle forums and the hate that spills out of Steam

Which is guess for small teams or single devs is less feasable the less resources they have. That is to say, you're alone out there.

[-] Fizz@lemmy.nz 2 points 1 month ago

I agree valves platform moderation is terrible but getting upset over some negative reviews from "charlietweet" and "toowoke" is bubblewrap levels of soft.

[-] sturmblast@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago

Part of the reason I don't play many multi-player games is the idiocy and racism

[-] carotte@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 month ago

for a more recent example, the negative reviews under Relooted are fucking sickening. one of the top ones is a joke making fun of George Floyd’s death.

what does steam do? nothing. valve is one of the most profitable companies per employee out there, and they have no pressure from investors to botch their work, they could absolutely moderate.

they actively choose not to, because despite what bootlickers on lemmy would have you believe, gabe newell is a libertarian dipshit who values "free speech" over the safety of marginalized people.

[-] paultimate14@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago

There are guidelines on Steam that ban such content, and you can report people for violating them.

So no, Steam does not do "nothing" as you claim. A very basic Internet search can confirm that.

Even better, users can rate reviews as helpful or unhelpful. Which is great for a wider variety of reasons, but is also good for reviews that get into a grey area or use dog whistles to hide their true intentions.

[-] carotte@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 month ago

as the article mentions, if you’d bothered to read it, steam rarely enforces their guidelines, which is the problem here

[-] paultimate14@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago

The article is behind a paywall. Do they have any statistics or evidence backing that sentiment or is it just vibes?

You can find articles and reddit posts claiming this same exact thing going back years, and yet personally when I go through the store and look through reviews it's really hard for me to come across hate speech, especially if you don't specifically look at reviews that have been downvoted to hell. It's never going to be perfect, but I encounter less hate speech on Steam than most other platforms.

[-] carotte@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 month ago

i didn't have any paywall, maybe it's a regional thing? here's a version that shouldn't have it.

anyways, here's a screenshot of the Relooted review i talked about. if you check the game's negative reviews and sort by most pertinent, it's the 3rd one. it was here yesterday, and despite me reporting it, it's still here today, and in fact has been here since february 11th. as time of writing, it has 373 people who found it useful, and 115 who found it funny. some of the comments under that review are critical, but most just say "based" and the like.

CW: screenshot of a racist review, makes fun of George Floyd's deathScreenshot of a negative Steam review, with 0.2 hours played. It reads: Ugh, what a game. It stinks. I cant breathe, I caaant breathe!

it's an anecdotal evidence, but as you said, "you can find articles and reddit posts claiming this same exact thing going back years", doesn't that mean it's a recurring problem?

[-] Darkenfolk@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 month ago

That's it? I kind of expected something worse with the whole stink your making about it.

It just your typical kiddie hater comment, not worth paying attention to and certainly not worthy of a moderator's time.

[-] Clbull@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Fucking hell. You were not kidding. This was posted five days ago! The comments on that review are even more vile, to the point where I don't even think I can show them here.

[-] ChicoSuave@lemmy.world 0 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

What do you want Steam to do? Be the judge and executioner of what lives and what dies? There is no agreed upon guidelines for what is chud behavior and not so how does Valve make that call?

VALUE PER EMPLOYEE MEANS NOTHING IN THIS CONTEXT. You are saying that fact to imply "rich people need to be the adults if they are going to have that money" and that is absolutely Monarch/Authoritarian enabler thinking. Fuck that.

Valve is not responsible for the shit other people say. Report them if you don't like it. As with democracy, with enough votes things will change. But one person mad at what another person says so they plead to a central authority to shut it down? The Internet has seen this decision turn into legal battles over speech after one trolling shithead decides to use the system against innocent people.

Stop listening to racists and this all goes away.

[-] missingno@fedia.io 1 points 1 month ago

What do you want Steam to do?

Moderate, like every other half-decent platform does.

[-] TalkingFlower@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago

They do moderate, threads disappear out of thin air, locked due to specific reasons. I've reported many, from minor insults to racism, and many of the times they take action. And I considered Steam more heavily moderated than both Lemmy and Reddit, unless you are in a beleaguered community.

The review section, though, is a dev problem; it can be a bit of a wildland, and that is true.

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[-] Korhaka@sopuli.xyz 1 points 1 month ago

Moderate your own forum, honestly its kinda based of Valve to be as hands off as they are. You set your own guidelines rather than having Valve force their own on you. It makes sense too given the variety of games on Steam.

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[-] Katana314@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago

The main reason Valve doesn’t step in on these is they have a firm philosophy of giving the community the tools to form their own outcomes, rather than directing them in every issue. So they might be dissatisfied with people writing “Woke TRASH!” braindead reviews, but also not want to take action on them.

The least they’ve done is remove the clown award so people have less incentive to troll. But I’d also like them to implement community blocklists; If you nag a game for “Having/not having LGBT representation”, you go on a blocklist 90% of the community is using.

[-] paultimate14@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago

They also have guidelines for "user generated content" which includes reviews, and you can report people for violating those guidelines.

Sure Valve does not pay for moderators to check things proactively. I quite like that they don't have AI or some other half-assed attempt at "moderation" like other platforms have. I hate the way that the whole Internet has moved to censor "fuck" and made up the word "unalive" because the automated systems of platforms I don't even use have decided they are the arbitora of what language is allowed.

I think the responsibility to monitor reviews should lie with whoever controls the Steam page: I would assume the publisher most of the time? The publisher and developer should be looking at reviews anyways. Add in the ability for users to vote reviews as helpful or unhelpful and I think it's one of the better systems left on the internet.

[-] Kolanaki@pawb.social 1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

You know you can "block all communication" from users and it blocks them EVERYWHERE on Steam, right? Not just in games, but in Friends and on the forums, too. IDK why you'd need community specific blocks over the normal blocking method already available.

[-] Baguette@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 month ago

Does the clown award still exist on profiles? I used to get added by randoms everytime and they always had the clown award because that's the easiest way for people to mark someone as a scammer

[-] imecth@fedia.io 1 points 1 month ago

The main reason Valve doesn't step in is because it would cost them money. Moderating content is expensive as hell and these corporations will bend themselves backwards finding any and every way to avoid it.

[-] radiouser@crazypeople.online 1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

I've tried contacting gaming press about this. I contacted Valve (several times) citing their own rules, screenshots of blatant transgressions and they repeatedly closed my ticket and ignored me. I avoid buying games directly from Steam now. If I can find the screenshots later I'll update my post.

Edit: So here is the ticket I opened (this was -months- after repeatedly reporting someone spamming the N-word in the Official Steam Deck group chat for weeks).

Valve customer support is the best, hurrr derrrr

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this post was submitted on 16 Feb 2026
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