have you ever been wage thefted? (hexbear.net)

submitted 10 months ago by g_g@hexbear.net to c/chapotraphouse@hexbear.net

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a few years ago i worked in a shitty little retail shop that was owned by two brothers i never met that lived in another state (the company owned a chain of these stores across 2 or 3 states, there were maybe 4 or 5 total stores). we used this ipad in a stand to clock in and out. you had to take a picture of yourself every time, which i despised. i had been there for maybe 7 months or so when one day i decided to look at the app that was like the user version of the app from the ipad. it had a record of all of my in and out times... and a record of every time they had been edited.

and edited they had been. every single shift, one of the two owners was shaving off between 1 and 15 minutes from clock out time. i brought it up with my manager, who i got along really well with, and got him to look at his. same thing. my other coworker, same thing. i went home and made a spreadsheet containing every single time it had happened for as far back as the records went. it ended up being something like $400 worth of time they had taken from me.

the next day i got a call from that owner, and he explained to me that he felt like i was taking too long to close the store, that it shouldn't take that long, and that he was sorry (sorry that he got caught!) and was going to add $200 to my next paycheck (half of what he stole), plus from now on all clock in and out times would be rounded to the nearest quarter hour, and asked me if that made it better.

i was in a pretty bad place at the time, financially and mentally, and for as terrible as that job was i did also kind of like it, and didn't think i could find anything better, so i accepted the money and the apology and let it go.

anything like that ever happened to you? did you do anything cooler than roll over like i did?

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[-] EmmaGoldman@hexbear.net 24 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Small business stores are so bad for this shit, I've worked at two different ones, and have been wage thefted both times. Also, both hired me to do technical jobs (maintaining websites, hardware in store, etc.) and then just decided "nevermind we need more cashiers and floor sweepers etc. so you have to be that now"

One of the stores was so bad on wage theft that he'd often "forget" to pay people or "put the wage rate in wrong" on fuckin' zendesk zenefits which is an automated system THAT HE HIRED ME TO SET UP AND MAINTAIN AND THEN LOCKED ME OUT OF so he literally had to be doing it manually and deliberately and covered his ass in the dumbest possible way. I talked to other employees about this, and literally nobody cared and everyone instantly rolled on it so I just quit after a couple months of trying to get people to organize.

[-] g_g@hexbear.net 19 points 10 months ago

yeah, although i'm not convinced that large corporations are all that much more innocent of this.

the changing of roles/expectations from what you were hired on to do it always a huge red flag. i learned that one when i got hired to do a very specific computer/digital media job at one place and they told me I might "occasionally need to scrub the toilets" oh-shit

[-] YearOfTheCommieDesktop@hexbear.net 16 points 10 months ago

large corporations steal more money but are a little sneakier about it from wha I gather. or they just let low level managers take the fall by setting impossible expectations

[-] EmmaGoldman@hexbear.net 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Worked a retail job in high school where they completely flipped on me and all of a sudden all cleaning of the entire store was my job and mine alone. Hired as a cashier and was still expected to do cashiering in addition to all cleanup. Nobody else was expected to clean. I called the Labour Program so fast when they tried to get me to do Hazmat cleanup for minimum wage.

[-] DamarcusArt@lemmygrad.ml 5 points 10 months ago

Large corporations do it via much more impersonal nickel and diming. Like they'll ensure that employee unpaid breaks are 30 minutes long, but the employee is expected to be back at their desk after 25 or else they'll be considered to be taking an hour long break and lose pay accordingly. Sometimes it can be as simple as just not giving employees increasing wages to keep up with inflation or lowballing people when they first start working there, promising raises that never manifest so you have employees working at an entry level wage 5 years after they started working there. very rare for it to actually be illegal in most of the west, they make sure it is all "above board"

[-] the_itsb@hexbear.net 8 points 10 months ago

literally nobody cared and everyone instantly rolled on it so I just quit after a couple months of trying to get people to organize.

This has been my experience with every unjust working situation I've been part of.

What does anyone ever do about this? How do you convince people to care when it's not safe to care?

[-] EmmaGoldman@hexbear.net 8 points 10 months ago

The junction between "not safe to care" and "safe to not care" makes a lot of retail/customer service jobs difficult to organize. Children that are working there literally could not possibly give a fuck about anything that happens to them or anyone else. Adults who work there are in extreme precarity and fear for their income severely.

[-] AntiOutsideAktion@hexbear.net 18 points 10 months ago

Amazon delivery driver here. It seems pretty common for people to do prep work before they let you clock in. The guy who I did my ride-along with skipped his 15 minute breaks.

[-] Aryuproudomenowdaddy@hexbear.net 16 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

When I worked at an Amazon warehouse it was expected to already have items pulled up to your station by the time a break was up, which required logging back in and sometimes waiting a few minutes for a robot to cross the floor. There were a lot of people who would just lay on the floor next to their work station so that they didn't spend several minutes walking back and forth from the break areas.

[-] RION@hexbear.net 14 points 10 months ago

my mom didn't get paid for two months one time. she needed her boss to write some special recommendation or sign off thingy for cooking school (the job was at a local cafe) and didn't want to anger her boss by raising the issue. also didn't get a lunch break either. sometimes she'll recall that and go "man that was pretty fucked up huh" and i'm like uhh YEAH

[-] YearOfTheCommieDesktop@hexbear.net 14 points 10 months ago

A criminally underpaid friend of mine had this happen (has an advanced med-adjacent degree, works in a lab, practically runsthe place but still makes like two steps above poverty wages).

iirc it was a coworker, not even the owner, and she was editing their times just enough so that they never got paid for the multiple hours of overtime they were doing each week. They did report it up the chain and got all of it paid back, but she wasn't even fired... They should have quit after that but they still haven't

[-] g_g@hexbear.net 14 points 10 months ago

yuck. imagine thinking your coworker doesn't deserve their overtime pay and that it is just of you to take it from them, to no benefit of your own. visible-disgust

[-] YearOfTheCommieDesktop@hexbear.net 11 points 10 months ago

yeah she sounded unhinged I really don't get it. she might technically outrank them but I don't think she's even their supervisor...

[-] HiImThomasPynchon@hexbear.net 11 points 10 months ago

Ex-Carny here. It's wage theft-a-palooza in that sector. And most of the employees are helpless because they're working under the table. I tried talking about some sort of collective action, but it became clear that they'd all be risking their disability/welfare income by making claims against the carnival we worked for.

[-] PointAndClique@hexbear.net 9 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Yes, to the tune of about $2000 at one job that I could calculate. I was manually filling out time sheets at a part time office job, and submitting them to accounts at the end of each week. They paid me on time and fully for two months, but after that I was only paid for about three weeks of every four. I raised it with the finance guy in my fourth month there and he was apologetic and said he could backpay. i gave it another month and he then basically said stiff bikkies, we've lost your time sheets you should have kept accurate record yourself.

Cos I was part time, people weren't super open with me but after long enough I worked out everyone there was underpaid, and the lead sales guy was super aggro and would harass others into not raising it with finance because he'd been there the longest and wanted to make sure he was paid first. Very crabs in a bucket mentality. I sucked it up unfortunately cos it was my first proper 'desk job' and I wanted good references.

Towards the end of my time I also had to take regular phonecalls from contractors and run defence when the company couldn't [wouldn't] pay invoices on time. One contractor threatened to come to our offices and wait in the carpark for me to come out. I'd already made up my mind to leave, but I quit the week after that.

Have been time thefted in a later job which was basically not honouring overtime, was doing regular unrecompensated OT.

[-] g_g@hexbear.net 7 points 10 months ago

the lead sales guy was super aggro and would harass others into not raising it with finance because he'd been there the longest and wanted to make sure he was paid first. Very crabs in a bucket mentality

what a total lack of class consciousness does to an mf

the part about being physically threatened by an unpaid contractor is really scary tho, i'm glad you got out of there

[-] PointAndClique@hexbear.net 8 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

the part about being physically threatened by an unpaid contractor is really scary tho, i'm glad you got out of there

I ain't even mad, like, I was in the exact same position as him. It's a shame the boss had a secure car park otherwise I'd have said sure dude, show up at four I'm the old bloke with the beemer

[-] the_itsb@hexbear.net 9 points 10 months ago

I discovered a very similar situation as a receptionist at a used car lot 20+ years ago. The lot was owned by a rich boy who had taken over for his late father, and the office was managed by his mother, who I'm pretty sure must be the top result when you image search "Harridan." She loved making people cry, she loved to rule with an iron fist, she enjoyed arguing and cussing - it was a wild place to work, and I was 18 and didn't yet realize how unacceptable everything was.

Anywho. They were archaic even then, but this place was using an old time clock with actual punchcards. I was a broke-ass barely-adult and Christmas was coming, and I was stressing hard about money. I noticed that my check hours and clock hours didn't match, so even though I was absolutely not permitted to dig through payroll and personnel stuff, I took advantage of her long lunches and dug out the records for previous weeks. The manager's handwritten notes to the side showed how many hours she was counting for each shift and that hours were being rounded down all over the place.

I told everyone. 😂 I even called the service garage and told them, they came up to look, it was fucking on. 😂😂😂 everybody was super pissed. The garage guys mentioned in their bitching about her that she had been having them do stuff to people's cars to bring them back or just not really fix them so they'd have to come back! Fucking wild that that really happens, but it's true.

I left a note resigning alongside my annotated time cards and walked out. She left a nasty voicemail at my apartment after she got back to the chaos I had created in the office, and I only reluctantly went back to get my last paycheck because she refused up mail it (she insisted she needed my signature proving that I had personally received it, but really, she needed one last opportunity to cuss me out and slam a door), so idk how many of the others actually quit. I had to threaten her via certified mail to get my paperwork for taxes the next year.

I would like to say that that was an empowering turning point in my life, but a lot of things went wrong in my personal life as a result of that incident, some of it directly so because of judgment about the irresponsible nature of my unplanned resignation. It didn't stop me. I have continued making things uncomfortable by insisting it's not okay to just live with injustice that we can reasonably, feasibly fix, and being unwilling to let things lie has caused a lot of problems in my personal life and contributed to my lack of popularity.

I don't think I'm the problem, though - I think comfort and apathy are the problem, so I don't have a ton of motivation to try to change that part of my personality so I can fit in better. I would rather be lonely than be in the company of comfortable cowards.

[-] BeamBrain@hexbear.net 9 points 10 months ago

They tried. At my last software engineering job, coworkers tried to pressure me into working unpaid overtime. I refused. Probably part of the reason I got fired from that job.

[-] infuziSporg@hexbear.net 7 points 10 months ago

I once had a job where I was given admin rights to the point-of-service system that everybody clocked in on.

Every so often I would edit the clock-in times of the coworkers I worked alongside to be 5 to 20 minutes earlier. A dollar here, a dollar there. I never edited my own hours though because it felt less ethical. I never got caught, and the ratio of time spent to time added was really low.

[-] kristina@hexbear.net 6 points 10 months ago

every day, every day...

[-] StellarTabi@hexbear.net 6 points 10 months ago

the next day i got a call from that owner, and he explained to me that he felt like i was taking too long to close the store, that it shouldn't take that long

maybe it wouldn't take OP so long to close if someone was helping instead of inputting lies into spreadsheets all day

[-] tamagotchicowboy@hexbear.net 6 points 10 months ago

Yes, when I substitute taught they'd skim me of whole days, fuck over my lunch and make me cover another class (and even teach at one school when they figured out I know math) pretty often. Even with a physical time sheet it was 50-50 if payroll was going to fix the issue.