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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/21049862

The only numbers I will ever spell are one and zero, and only when using them as a pronoun, or for emphasis, respectively.

Is there ever a reason to not to use symbols when dealing with numbers? Why would "fourteen whatevers" ever be preferable to "14 whatevers". It's just so much easier to read numbers as symbols, not spelled out.

(Caveat, not including multipliers, like "273 billion").

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[-] Anticorp@lemmy.world 11 points 1 day ago

In nineteen ninety eight The Undertaker threw Mankind off Hell In A Cell, and he plummeted 16 ft through an announcer's table.

[-] Asclepiaz@lemmy.world 2 points 17 hours ago

**Sixteen feet

For manufacturing I've taken to using spelled out numbers when quantities and names both use numbers. Four 4s rather than 4 4s. Makes it harder for someone to speed through an email and get the completey wrong information.

[-] captainlezbian@lemmy.world 8 points 1 day ago

Next you’re gonna ask me to use actual scientific notation instead of to the most relevant 3 decimal points. I will not use your bullshit centimeters, that’s just 10 mms

[-] MisterFrog@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago

Absolutely, mm > cm all the way. Other than you putting s at the end of mm, we don't take the Lord's (metric) name in vain around here.

I do feel kind of sorry for East Asia though, since their languages seperate at intervals of 10⁴, rather than 10³. The giga and mega prefixes just make no sense there. 1 GW = 10,0000,0000 W and 1 MW = 100,0000.

Language strikes again

Not sure, but perhaps they would prefer a prefix of 10^-4^ rather than mm (10^-3^).

[-] Classy@sh.itjust.works 3 points 23 hours ago

Wtf I've never heard of this, what a cursed way to notate large numbers

[-] MisterFrog@lemmy.world 7 points 23 hours ago

It's not cursed, it's just a different way of grouping. Nothing about grouping in multiples of 10³ is a more natural grouping, were just more used to it.

And I'm pointing out how metric prefixes are actually euro-centric, and that's annoying for them. But there's nothing fundamentally worse about breaking digits in groups of 4, rather than 3

1,000,000,000,000 = 1,0000,0000,0000 (10^12^) [Meme of black and white muscular arms embracing.]

Look up the indian system, now that's actually cursed.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_numbering_system

[-] thann@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 1 day ago
[-] Iron_Lynx@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

Zero.
One.
Zero.
One.
One.
Zero.
Zero.
One.

[-] ValenThyme@reddthat.com 8 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

🎶The humans are dead! 🎵

[-] Iron_Lynx@lemmy.world 3 points 9 hours ago

That's one way to summarise what that number sequence is tied to.

[-] somebodysomewhere@lemmy.world 14 points 1 day ago

Not just an engineer thing though. Everyone finds it obnoxious.

As a mathematician, I refuse to do this.

[-] MisterFrog@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago

Stay strong friend 🫡, and don't you let them take your numerals from you

[-] YeetPics@mander.xyz 23 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

"One and eight hundred and fifty two thousandths".

Or

"1.852"

You get to decide what's efficient to communicate a specific value based on the criticality of precision and the format of communication.

Like it or not, but peak-compatibility IS peak-efficiency when it comes to language.

[-] LANIK2000@lemmy.world 6 points 1 day ago

I especially hate what we the Czechs do. We mostly read numbers the same (21 = twenty one), but then once every blue moon some dimwit says 21 like "one and twenty" like he's fucking German or something. German is bad enough, but why do we have to mix it???

[-] notthebees@reddthat.com 1 points 21 hours ago

I thought it was french that did that

[-] LANIK2000@lemmy.world 3 points 18 hours ago

French is even more special.

Tho like I said before, it's not perfectly accurate. In Czech 90 + 2 is the official way, but many people around Prague and closer to Germany do in fact occasionally say 2 + 90.

[-] MisterFrog@lemmy.world 9 points 1 day ago

1.852 all the way in every single context. I will die on this hill haha

[-] YeetPics@mander.xyz 3 points 1 day ago

We die on that hill together, brother!

[-] Eiri@lemmy.ca 70 points 2 days ago

What kills me is when people will mix the two in a single context.

"Between eight and 13 percent"

NO. If you're writing one number in digits, you need to write them all the same way.

[-] KoalaUnknown@lemmy.world 33 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Sometimes it’s actually better to mix them.

Example from Purdue Owl:

Unclear: The club celebrated the birthdays of 6 90-year-olds who were born in the city.

Clearer: The club celebrated the birthdays of six 90-year-olds who were born in the city.

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[-] Zwiebel@feddit.org 12 points 2 days ago

But unlike eight 13 is above ten

[-] ftbd@feddit.org 11 points 2 days ago

But 8% and 13% are both below 10

[-] RisingSwell@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 1 day ago

So is 999%

And I've just learned percent is under two layers of keyboard menus so that's just fantastic.

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[-] mosiacmango@lemm.ee 9 points 2 days ago

This kills me, but its not as bad as the habit of new articles/print authors to switch between first and last names of the same person within a few sentences.

They will introduce Jeff Snoms, and then refer to them has "Jeff" and "Snoms" interchangeably for no discernable reason. It gets really maddening when they are doing it with 3 or 4 people, so suddenly the story has 2x as many characters involved.

[-] i_love_FFT@lemmy.ml 8 points 2 days ago

Wait till you read russian novels, where everyone's got 3 names and 2 official nickname everyone is expected to know...

[-] lseif@sopuli.xyz 4 points 1 day ago

not to mention the fact that it's written in russian!

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[-] tiramichu@lemm.ee 75 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Context is everything, IMO.

In engineering work, numbers should always be digits. In prose, numbers should be spelled out.

Breakfast at the Thompson's was a busy affair; 12 eggs and 6 rounds of toast for their 3 sets of boistrous twins.

Compared to

Breakfast at the Thompson's was a busy affair; twelve eggs and six rounds of toast for their three sets of boistrous twins.

To me it's pretty clear which of those reads better and more naturally as prose; digits really 'jump out' on the page, and while that is great for engineering texts, it is incongruent and distracting for prose.

[-] lengau@midwest.social 40 points 2 days ago

Somewhat relevant to your example, recipes should have numbers in digits too. (But then again recipes are basically an engineering text.)

[-] exasperation@lemm.ee 24 points 2 days ago

recipes are basically an engineering text

I would love to see more systematic recipe formats.

Around 15-20 years ago there was a website called "Cooking for Engineers" that used a table format for recipes that was pretty clever, and a very useful diagram for how to visualize the steps (at least for someone like me). I don't think he ever updated the site to be mobile friendly but you can see it here:

Cheesecake
Dirty Rice

He describes the recipe in a descriptive way, but down at the bottom it lists ingredients and how they go together in a chart that shows what amounts to use, what ingredients go into a particular step, what that step is, and how the product of that step feeds into the next step.

[-] captainlezbian@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

Oh damn that’s a sensical format. I love it and may put my recipes in it once I start writing them properly

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[-] BodePlotHole@lemmy.world 33 points 2 days ago

Engineer here.

Typically when I type out professional emails or documents that contain numerical values, I write out the number followed by the digits in brackets if it is ten [10] or below for cases of amount, unless I am listing out the counts of items, then I only use digits.

"The updated electrical design will require three [3] new, pad-mount 500kVA transformers to replace the three [3] existing 225kVA transformers,each located on floors four, five, and six."

[-] biovoid@midwest.social 1 points 1 hour ago

I'll write out a count without a digit if it's immediately next to a value. Like without other qualifiers: "three 500 kVA transformers", versus "3 500 kVA transformers" (horrible), or even "three [3] 500 kVA transformers" (acceptable, but perhaps cluttered)

(Also note the space between value and unit—technically required but I'm not consistent about it)

[-] MisterFrog@lemmy.world 8 points 1 day ago

Can I ask why, though? I'm also an engineer and I just never spell it out, if I can avoid it (so far, luckily, haven't had push back since I'm on delivery and not proposals or anything like that.)

To me, it's just more annoying to read it as words, and no matter what you do, mistakes can still happen, including when it's spelled out.

Just my 2 cents.

[-] BodePlotHole@lemmy.world 18 points 1 day ago

I work in MEP and our emails are always considered legal documents as they can be used as evidence if ever we are taken to court. So we always treat them very technical and try to over explain everything so clients/plan reviewers/contractors can't misinterpret. It's kind of an old school thing, but the head of our department is an old school guy.

[-] captainlezbian@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

I only spell out numbers as the first word of a sentence because idk how to capitalize in that situation.

[-] NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.de 30 points 2 days ago

There are exceptions to every rule. Sometimes it ends up being "between five and 15" which is psychotic.

[-] brown567@sh.itjust.works 15 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Three and four hundred fifteen quintillion five hundred ninety two quadrillion six hundred fifty three trillion five hundred eighty nine billion seven hundred ninety three million two hundred thirty eight thousand four hundred sixty three sextillionths

Is less than ten

[-] Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works 19 points 2 days ago

Caveat, not including multipliers, like "273 billion"

You mean 273e9?

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[-] Eheran@lemmy.world 17 points 2 days ago

Any number that I write down is a number. I am not writing novels, the numbers I write down are supposed to be easy you find. You look through the document to find numbers, that is easy to do.

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[-] Mechaguana@programming.dev 9 points 2 days ago

00, 01, 10 there i did it

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this post was submitted on 20 Oct 2024
461 points (97.7% liked)

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