18
submitted 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) by Iunnrais@lemmy.world to c/showerthoughts@lemmy.world

Sony believed that they had so much market share that they could make a console that was leaps and bounds more complicated to code for, which would lock devs in and prevent them from going elsewhere, and they’d just have to suck it up because of said market share. Sony was wrong, and they lost out big time that generation (although they did manage to win the Blu-ray vs hd-dvd format wars).

Microsoft seems to believe they have so much market share that they can force people to upgrade to a privacy invading, ai infested piece of crap, and that everyone needs to suck it up because market share.

I’ve already started hearing wind that people, in statistically significant numbers, are finding alternatives… so is this the same situation as the ps3?

Just a passing musing without much to back up the gut feelings.

top 45 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[-] MystikIncarnate@lemmy.ca 3 points 2 months ago

I work in IT. IMO, the civilian population moving to Linux is inevitable. As Linux finds itself and good ways to do things that don't require people to know bash, or customize options by manually editing config files, things will push that way.

IMO, it will happen, but not quite yet. We're seeing the initial push of the privacy conscious and those that want to avoid becoming a product. It's good, but we're not there yet. We're also seeing some pretty major players, most notably valve, pushing for consumer goods that are unashamedly Linux under the hood. This is, slowly but surely, pushing forward compatibility for apps running on Linux.

We probably won't see any line of business apps adopting a Linux build any time soon, and business in general actually wants the majority of what Microsoft is pushing for.... Along with government institutions (for their own needs), and more. I don't see business moving towards Linux anytime soon... Not beyond it's current role in server operations.

As stuff like steamOS get better and better, and find ways to solve problems in consumer friendly ways, that knowledge will feed back into existing Linux tools. We'll get to a point where Linux will be as plug and play as Windows, and that's when we actually have a good chance of migrating a lot of personal PCs to Linux.

The Battle for the workplace is still a long way out. Well after the Linux home PC is commonplace. People at the office will simply have more experience with Linux, and push for being able to use Linux at work and eventually that's going to start to happen... Probably not in our lifetimes.

To me, it's only a matter of time. Unless Linux undergoes a hostile takeover and unforeseen bullshit happens, it will happen.

[-] ripcord@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago

I'm pretty sure this is a repost of a comment I read in 2004.

[-] Godort@lemmy.ca 3 points 2 months ago

Microsoft is bleeding power users and PC enthusiasts at an unprecedented rate. This is a great thing for Linux, but they are still absolutely locked into the corporate world and that's where the money is.

The reality is that Microsoft solved management of corporate policy and identity like 25 years ago and nothing else has come close. It has its problems, but Active Directory is an incredible piece of software. The combination of LDAP, with obfuscation of Kerberos to the point where you don't even need to know it exists, combined with policy deployment to endpoints is nothing short of a miracle.

Linux has tools for all those things, but none are easy to deploy or configure. If you have to manage thousands of desktops, Windows is still the clear choice

[-] toiletobserver@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

If you are a large corporation or government, you'd have the resources to do exactly that. I keep hearing about European governments moving to Linux. And why wouldn't you? Screw perpetual licensing.

[-] Godort@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 months ago

What those EU governments are doing is out of interest for national security rather than hate for licensing. The US has changed drastically in the last decade and getting your sensitive data out of their infrastructure is a top priority.

The cost of change from Windows to Linux is pretty small for an individual. Most people have one or two machines and a handful of programs, none of which are critical to your continued existence.

In the corporate world, you need to be absolutely sure that everything will work flawlessly, which often means weeks or months of testing on top of all your regular IT duties, constant support tickets to obscure software vendors who may not have ever worked with Linux, and if some mission-critical piece of software breaks, then the company cannot operate until it is fixed...or you can continue to use Windows, even though it sucks more now.

I want Linux to have wider adoption in the desktop space, but it's a catch 22. People aren't going to move unless the software is guaranteed to work, and Linux-based software isn't going to be made unless people are using it. This is why Proton was such a big deal. It offered a real option for gaming to move to the platform and now it's viable and devs are starting to take linux into account.

[-] jrs100000@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Its not a guarantee of flawless operation thats required, its a source of liability if something goes wrong. Someone has to be responsible if the latest update blows everything up.

[-] village604@adultswim.fan 1 points 2 months ago

I'm sure large organizations moving to Linux are also choosing a distro that has paid support. It's probably still cheaper than Microsoft licensing, though.

[-] mlg@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

AD and LDAP is notoriously insecure as hell by default. It took until 24H2 for MSFT to enable SMB signing, which was a solid 50% chance for an unauthenticated attacker to reach domain admin on any enterprise network.

There are a lot of solutions that eclipse AD in both quality and scope. It's just like VMWare, a once solid product that orgs got vendor locked into, and are stuck for life.

[-] Brkdncr@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

It’s a backwards compatibility issue. MS has been telling people for years that defaults are not secure. I have enterprise grade equipment in production that doesn’t support smb signing by default.

Shit is crazy.

[-] y0kai@anarchist.nexus 2 points 2 months ago

one can hope, but I think it's a long shot. Most of my normie friends aren't going to switch even if microsoft assigned a live person to sit next to them and monitor their usage. "it needs to just work, and i know how to use it" they say (or something along those lines).

[-] Ghostalmedia@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago

When recently onboarding for a new job I heard something I never thought I would hear in my life.

Everyone was given a Mac. Eng, design, finance, HR. Everyone. In my onboarding cohort, someone in finance asked if they could have a Windows PC, which has been the backbone of finance orgs for decades. IT said no. They just didn’t want to deal with Microsoft’s enterprise ecosystem.

[-] Funwayguy@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

I got the same treatment recently. All tech departments were issued M4 Mac Book Pros because that was more cost effective than than dealing with the non-compliant fuckery of W11. Unfortunately non-tech departments got the old inventory and are suffering the abhorrent instability of W11. It somehow refuses to play nice with just about everything in our corporate ecosystem.

[-] Lfrith@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 months ago

That's nice to see actually. Regular consumers like us don't have any pull, but businesses do. So I hope more start seeing Microsoft problematic enough to start shifting away to MacOS to get Microsoft to reassess their decisions.

[-] fubbernuckin@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 months ago

I fear Microsoft will simply not reassess their decisions and we'll be stuck with Apple, who has historically been much worse about user freedom.

[-] TheLeadenSea@sh.itjust.works 0 points 2 months ago

But macOS is even more locked down than windows?

[-] 9point6@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

They specifically mentioned the enterprise ecosystem.

I would not be surprised at all if Apple's MDM system is less painful to use for smaller businesses than Microsoft's AD and everything attached to it. Hell it might even be nicer for big orgs, but I've never heard of one (apart from the likes of Google) not using AD

Also if you're already dealing with one of those systems, an IT department is probably motivated to not run both and set up interop if they can avoid it

[-] mlg@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago

As someone who went through this, I would honestly take Window 11's bs over pos unusable mac.

First time ever I think I felt pain in my wrist from using a trackpad. Absolute clownshow of a UX

[-] Ghostalmedia@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago

Interesting. I’ve got of gripes with Apple hardware (price, upgradability, silly things like notches and Touch Bars,) but trackpads has never been one of them. I’ve always thought the’ve had some of the best trackpads.

What trackpad do you prefer and why?

[-] mlg@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Oh no the trackpad itself is actually pretty okay. Its the fact that I have to drag a ridiculous length for the subsequent input to match on screen, even with the highest sensitivity setting.

Apple's ingenious design was to make the trackpad feel like a 1:1 representation of your display, which is why its so huge.

And since way too much stuff in MacOS is functional around mouse clicks, I was constantly swiping all over the place for basic functions.

I think apple users kind of got used to using only their arm, but thats hard for me to do since I'm used to regular old trackpads and mice.

EDIT: Comparatively, I'm fine one something like a thinkpad or even a very cheap HP notebook, so long as the OS or Application UX is cool enough to keep things sensible.

[-] Ghostalmedia@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Weird. I never noticed that. I bump mine up a bit from the default, but I don’t max it out. That’s way too fast for me to handle.

I do know there are ton of apps that will override the defaults. I think the OG better touch tool will let you max that thing to warp speed.

[-] KiwiTB@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago
  1. Sony won that generation.
  2. The games are still being made for Windows. The time it takes to lose that whole platform would allow them plenty of time to correct their path.
  3. Microsoft are crooked AF.... They've been keeping their monopoly status for over 30 years. They won't let that change.
[-] vane@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Nah it was Wii controller and Wii Sports that Sony lost to. Wii Sports sold over 83M copies, other Wii games like Wii Sports Resort 33M, Wii Play 28M, Wii Fit 22M. Wii controller was what crashed other consoles. That was what put Nintendo back on the top after Nintendo 64 flop. Compare it to PS2 - best Sony console, best sold game is GTA San Andreas and it sold only 17M copies.

What keeps Windows afloat is Office 365 for corporations and companies.

No kid will have Linux at home if their parents work for corpo and are no tech nerds.

[-] Rooster326@programming.dev 1 points 2 months ago

They had everything going for it.

The Wii Controller. The Wii Fit. Wii Bowling. That Wii U Streaming device so you could play Wii Sports on the go. They were truly leaps and bounds ahead.

[-] kandoh@reddthat.com 1 points 2 months ago

Maybe for home computing which isn't their priority. They've always had their bread buttered by corporate business

[-] partial_accumen@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

While I run Linux on a desktop, I've always owned a Windows laptop. I decided last week that instead of ever running Windows 11, I'm going to buy a Macbook and dual boot it with Linux. Yes I know I can run Linux on any number of PC hardware laptops, there are occasionally windows only utilities needed to run firmware or some other proprieatry application. If I can know I can always fall back to OSX for system updates and running proprietary commercial software, I'll know I never need to touch Windows 11.

May when Microsoft realizes Windows 11 is Vista 2.0, Windows 12 may be great. With Linux and OSX, I don't see myself coming back to Windows even then though.

[-] NigelFrobisher@aussie.zone 1 points 2 months ago

That seems like a very different situation.

[-] titanicx@lemmy.zip 1 points 2 months ago

And honestly you're not hearing that people in broad swath of numbers are replacing Windows you're hearing in a very echo chamber like here or Reddit or possibly dig that people are replacing windows it's still a small number statistically and while it's slightly growing it's still not enough that's going to matter to Microsoft even in the least bit. The average person is not going to know what to do and the average person is not going to understand or even know that there's an alternative besides macintosh. Nor are they going to attempt to install an alternative version of an operating system. I mean hell I couldn't even convince my dad to buy a $200 laptop over the $900 gaming PC for the 40 minutes of work he does on computers a week. Some people just are going to do what they do out of habit and not even care.

[-] stevedice@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago

lol no. As much as I would love for Microsoft to go die in a hole, nobody is moving away from Windows. Sensationalist headlines heralding the downfall of Microsoft due to Windows $CURRENT being the worst ever version of Windows have been around since the epoch of Windows itself. People are always moving in droves to Linux. People are always refusing to update to Windows $CURRENT. I've heard it. You've heard it. We've all heard it. And we'll all keep hearing it until the end of times. In the meantime, corporations still depend on that one piece of software they paid for 10 years ago that only runs on Windows, and people are still buying new machines that an OEM already put the latest version of Windows on.

[-] Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Lets not forget too that Sony ever only started making video games at all because Nintendo thought they had such strong market share that they could bully Phillips AND Sony. Phillips ended up being a little bitch, and didn't do anything noteworthy. But Sony? Sony bent Nintendo over a barrel, and took their lunch money.

And then waited 10 years to make the same exact mistake.

[-] IWW4@lemmy.zip 0 points 2 months ago

It wouldn’t be the first time a Microsoft OS was a total disaster.

[-] WhiskyTangoFoxtrot@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Usually Microsoft releases new versions quickly enough to leap-frog each other, though. Windows 98 was still supported when Windows XP was released, so nobody really needed to use WinME. The same thing happened with Windows Vista and 8. People could always just skip over the especially-shitty versions and wait for the next, not-quite-as-shitty version to come out before upgrading. They can't do that with Windows 11, though.

[-] pulsewidth@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago

It does more or less follow the age-old Microsoft pattern: One disaster OS, followed by one improved OS people mostly enjoy.

Only problem for them is that this time there's actually way more viable OS options for average people to turn to, and they've simultaneously leaned heavily into surveillance capitalism, monitoring, and AI when all of those things are broadly unwelcome. Its a recipe for a big loss in market share, and I can't say I don't love that for them.

[-] HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

we'v e had improved ms oses since 7?

[-] NateNate60@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

It's hard to argue that Windows 10 isn't way better than Windows 7 in terms of user interface, workflow patterns, security, and feature support. Despite the fact that Windows 10 comes with a lot of useless junk. Hell, even the junk it came with (Microsoft Edge, Cortana, OneDrive) is more useful than the junk Windows 7 also came with.

And similarly, while people have a lot of nostalgia for Windows XP, from an absolute standpoint, Windows XP is complete ass as an operating system. It was only good in comparison to Windows 2000, ME, and 98/95.

[-] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago

Every other version of windows flops or sucks. 98 SE, good. 2k/ME, No. XP, great. Vista,no. 7, great. 8, No.

10…probably the last good Windows unless M$oft unfucks itself and makes 12 good. But I doubt it.

[-] stevedice@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago

10…probably the last good Windows

Everybody and their mother complained about how bad and privacy invasive Windows 10 was. Hell, the most famous software to fix the privacy issues of Windows 11 is still called Shut Up 10. This backlash is nothing more than people resisting change.

[-] RubberElectrons@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Definitely wouldn't equate 2k with ME.

[-] SoyTDI@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago

And then Microsoft made the same mistake with Xbox One+Kinect.

[-] bobgobbler@lemmy.zip 2 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

But then quickly stopped making Kinect mandatory. Plus the Kinect was a wonderful piece of hardware.

Seriously they provided a kinect less bundle 6 months after launch

[-] SoyTDI@lemmy.world -1 points 2 months ago

Seriously they provided a kinect less bundle 6 months after launch

I wonder why 🙄.

I would add Xbox One+Kinect+Always online+the used games policy.

[-] Treczoks@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago

Every once in a while, Microsoft makes fundamental mistakes which they only survive because of their size. Think Microsoft Bob or Windows 8. Looks like Windows 11 is heading in the same direction.

[-] InFerNo@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 months ago

Nobody sees it that way, nobody notices what we notice. They don't know any alternatives, it has new features so it's innovating, it does what they want/need. I hear no complaints, only from tech people who are invested in privacy and digital sovereignty. That's the reality.

[-] AyD@lemmy.blahaj.zone -1 points 2 months ago

That must of been a long shower thinking about this

[-] Jerkface@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

I've come to the conclusion that Lemmy has the same thoughts in or out of the shower.

[-] zod000@lemmy.dbzer0.com -2 points 2 months ago

No way, unlike Windows 11, the PS3 was actually quite a good product.

this post was submitted on 18 Nov 2025
18 points (84.6% liked)

Showerthoughts

39501 readers
170 users here now

A "Showerthought" is a simple term used to describe the thoughts that pop into your head while you're doing everyday things like taking a shower, driving, or just daydreaming. The most popular seem to be lighthearted clever little truths, hidden in daily life.

Here are some examples to inspire your own showerthoughts:

Rules

  1. All posts must be showerthoughts
  2. The entire showerthought must be in the title
  3. No politics
    • If your topic is in a grey area, please phrase it to emphasize the fascinating aspects, not the dramatic aspects. You can do this by avoiding overly politicized terms such as "capitalism" and "communism". If you must make comparisons, you can say something is different without saying something is better/worse.
    • A good place for politics is c/politicaldiscussion
  4. Posts must be original/unique
  5. Adhere to Lemmy's Code of Conduct and the TOS

If you made it this far, showerthoughts is accepting new mods. This community is generally tame so its not a lot of work, but having a few more mods would help reports get addressed a little sooner.

Whats it like to be a mod? Reports just show up as messages in your Lemmy inbox, and if a different mod has already addressed the report, the message goes away and you never worry about it.

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS