And next on Fox News, we will hear from the experts both sides of the issue, the researchers and the internet jackass.
Spot the Brit?
Not sure which other countries have 3y bachelor's degrees and will let you do a PhD without a master's degree and also have 3y doctorate degrees
Where do you need a Masters to attain a PhD? Honest question, I just never heard of it before.
My wife attained her MD/PhD from the University of Chicago/Pritzker and does not have a Masters. She's on the MD/PhD committee for her university and they do not require anything other than a BS in the field of study.
With that said, it probably isn't much of a stretch to just get a Masters in the way to a PhD.
Me? I'm depriving some poor village of its idiot. I have a BS and that's it.
In the EU it's usually like that. 3 years for a bachelor's, 2 years for a master's, only then you can start pursuing a phd.
I graduated in 2005, and back then we had a different system, where I did a single 5 year program for a computer science degree (engineering), that today is the equivalent of a master's (diplom engineer). I could have continued to go for a dedicated master's, another 2 years, but I got lazy.
This is true in Sweden. Though by the 5 year program you might be Swedish too. // Got a civilingenjörsexamen
Definitely depends on the field. Most "humanities" studies require a masters first, although for that reason many PhD programs include the step of getting your masters so it can all be done as a single track. So still a standard ~6 year program but you get both, masters after the first 3 and then PhD after 3 more. I've only ever run with folks in humanities I'm realizing, so I didn't even realize there were PhDs you could get without a masters
Three years for a PhD? Must be a Brit or combined degree. Average is almost six at the moment.
They are 5-6 in my neck of the woods. You can go straight to a PhD from a bachelor's though
I'm a microbiologist in the US, it's at least eight years for us.
Even as a Brit that'd be fast. Here you're funded for 3.5y with 6mo unfunded "writing up time".
Simple solution, spend 1 second and decide to consciously ignore guy on internet for the rest of your life.
Works wonders for mental and physical health, zero downsides!
True. Until 70+ million of them decide to vote in a fascist dictatorship.
Fucking happening over here. The thing with echo chambers is that someone eventually starts farting, and then people start breathing it in. Those people start farting, and boom a moronic fascist dictatorship or radical conspiracy group is born
Well, sometimes there's another step missing just before the Bullshit: "Use the small, narrow findings to inform a greater narrative beyond the data's scope"
Alternatively: Be pressured to churn out papers by the university's MBA-crazed leadership, make weakly-supported assertions in order to make a paper exciting enough to be published. Your peers in academia and industry call you out on social media when they become aware of your dubious claims.
...obviously, that's an extreme situation. It's true, usually the people working with a given subject on a daily basis will have a better grasp than random, disreputable voices on the internet. Being critical of sources and reasoning is important.
Doesn't even take direct pressure from others. Getting published is one of the best ways to gain access to funds/resources, and just as with every other profession many will succumb to the temptation to take shortcuts or fudge the truth in the pursuit of money and/or prestige. I knew one woman who gave up on pursuing a career in cultural anthropology because she had come to believe that getting published was more of an exercise in creative writing than in actual science.
It's actually much more common than people think. Oh your numbers don't match what the rest of every else's says? Fudge the numbers a tiny bit nobody will notice. That way when you have to defend your work it's a little easier because it's in like with other work.
Hasn't read the article methods but still decided to comment: cOrReLaTiOn dOeSn't eQuAl cAuSaTiOn
Correlation doesn't imply causation, but it does waggle its eyebrows suggestively and gesture furtively while mouthing 'look over there'.
guy on lemmy “this was already obvious, why don’t they try studying something actually useful”
This, but to some degree, unironically. If studies aren't reproducible (or deemed worthy of reproduction) then there's definitely a disconnect between the folks handing out research assignments and the folks engineering applicable solutions to scientific problems.
That goes two ways. You could be a guy who successfully formulates a mathematical model to support the existence of Neutrinos and face a funding board that has no interest in building a LHC. That's arguably a problem of malinvestment within the scientific community. Or you could be a guy who successfully formulates a mathematical model for a new kind of mouse trap that's 10% less efficient than traditional mouse traps. That's more of a university research assignment problem. Or you could have a researcher who claims he's the only one who can do a particular thing, because he's got the magic touch. If the research is unfalsifiable by design, that's an entirely new kind of problem.
Dunning Kruger curve. The people who know the least about a topic speak the most confidently about it.
Don't think it's exactly Dunning Kruger. We all think about the curve of gathered knowledge and perceived knowledge.
But they didn't even start to gather knowledge, they just respond with something that sounds truthful and fits their world view in order to feel better without doing anything.
But hey maybe that's just my Dunning Kruger talking.
If after all that preparation, your pride can be pierced and wounded by one of myriad neckbeards or Karens on twatter, you might need to let go a little bit.
The worst part is when that guy's right.
Yup. They forgot that sometimes what's actually happening in that one line is-
To be fair, journal articles and scientific research in general have gotten to be pretty bullshit. Haven't they studied this and proven the vast majority of published journal papers probably shouldn't have been?
A couple easily Google examples of discussion regarding scientific publications likely being bullshit.
Why Most Published Research Findings Are False
Surge in number of ‘extremely productive’ authors concerns scientists
Too much academic research is being published
More than 10,000 research papers were retracted in 2023 — a new record
Whistleblowers flagged 300 scientific papers for retraction. Many journals ghosted them
Top 10 most highly cited retracted papers
And on and on. Publish or perish and general shitty culture in academia is why I quit phd and took my masters and left.
I saw a clip on how kids out of uni don't believe anything not peer reviewed; even intuitive observations in nature that otherwise undocumented or site specific observations that went against the grain.
Science is a way of thinking and observing, rather than papers, but papers are a good way to refine your thinking
In theory, a paper gives you a methodology that you can use to reproduce the findings. And a refusal to use papers to repeat findings (because shit costs money and nobody wants to publish iterative studies) means you end up with a bunch of novel findings that are never confirmed through repetition.
But the fact that nobody is bothering to repeat these studies also raises a question of what exactly is being researched. Certainly, the more useful scientific research efforts are about formulating applicable techniques. So they would need to be reproducible to have any functional value.
The fact that we're not seeking to replicate studies suggests that we're investing a ton of time in niche under-utilized fields. And that may be a problem of investigative research (we're so focused on publishing that we don't care what we're actually studying) or a problem of applied sciences (we're so focused on scaling up older methods to industrial scale that we're leaving better methods of production on the cutting room floor).
But its definitely some kind of problem.
TBF I’ve lost count of the number of times someone has cited some paper as a reference for the point they are trying to make and when I inspect the paper it has shitty “n”, the paper is written for an agenda (not sure what that’s called where I.e. a paper saying smoking is good for you/not harmful is paid for by the tobacco industry and written by tobacco industry scientists), or it might even just be straight up bullshit written to look like a legit paper.
Peer Review at least offers some barriers to the problems with papers, but it’s definitely not a panacea.
Worst best shiitpost ever. Absolutely the truth.
Sometimes it is bullshit.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2024/02/scientists-aghast-at-bizarre-ai-rat-with-huge-genitals-in-peer-reviewed-article/
Like callouscomic said, sometimes academics are incentivised to churn out bullshit
Guy on internet: "this study is flawed in the following ways [proceeds to list shit they thought of in 25 seconds that may in no way matter, but since they thought of it, it totally disqualifies any and all science which may not agree with the armchair brain farts]"
Maybe that guy was just one of the people who worked on one of the 19 other studies that didn't publish because of the negative result
You know, the guy on the internet might have also been doing stuff all that time
Yeap, that sounds like my reviewers :(
Why are they always so concerned with guy on Internet?
Because most of the population is partly 'guy on internet' and is influenced by other guys on internet
My dad has a friend who is like 65. I lives quite isolated. He's not dumb or anything at all, but he only talks to maybe 6 people and 4 of them are alcoholics and almost as sheltered as he is. The other day i went by because my dad asked me to help him.bwe talked for a bit and he said his knee is fucked but don't want t o do anything about it. I just shrugged and said that everything involving knee or hip surgery is scary. Hell, every surgery is pretty scary. Somehow the conversation (obviously) pivot towards covid. And he said he'll never get another vaccine in his life, because it was a plot from the higher ups, covid is made to kill people but it didn't kill enough. What struck me the most was he kinda saw that i didn't cared abd disagreed, so he quickly said: it's not just me, many people are saying it. Yeah sure, but i also know the people you hang out with who are "saying it" and who have "theories".
That is the guy on the internet, who doesn't even has the internet.
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