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Why do D&D books have to be so expensive?
(hexbear.net)
No you need to pirate books to do so
I have trouble navigating the PDFs but it’s looking like I don’t have a choice. I don’t have that kind of money.
The physical books can be had on secondhand bookstores for significantly less, albeit they're still sold for more than they aught to be, usually. Thriftbooks is an online reseller that has them for around $25 USD but local thrift stores and library book sales have them sometimes and will sell them for next to nothing.
There are some inexpensive/free programs/websites that exist to automate and simplify basically everything in the game. IME the only advantages the manuals have over the apps is that the manuals convey the bigger picture of how the game works.
5etools is your friend
Hasbro gotta make that $$$
Just steal them, pdfs aren't hard to find.
Pick a different system, or download copies and have them printed, or just print the key pages, or look for used copies. Also 5e.tools is a great resource
Eclipse Phase is available free because the designers are all filthy anarchists.
Yeah but then you gotta play Eclipse Phase.
Love the setting, the system is pretty janky (I have not read 2e)
Supposedly 2e is significantly more playable. I think there's also a powered by the apocalypse version.
Also presumably if TheDoctor is looking at D&D they're interested in fantasy adventure and not like, hard-ish scifi intrigue
I’m not personally opposed to sci-fi, but my wife has been reading a lot of fantasy the past year or so so that’s probably what I’m gonna go with.
It's very, very, similar to GURPS Transhuman Space - mainly adding Cortical Stacks from Altered Carbon, spessmagic, and an apocalypse.
There wouldn't be many problems just running the setting with THS.
To your points, D&D would be a terrible choice.
- It's balanced around a party of 4-6
- It has almost no advice of how to run it
- It's incredibly combat-focused, with balance assuming you'll get into 6+ fights per in-game day
Glad to hear you're going with something else, good luck!
Pathfinder has a lot of materials available online for free. It's got enough in common with D&D to matter and the things you buy won't be feeding the WOTC/Hasbro corpo octopus with its increasingly insidious pricing and monetization and subscription-seeking.
Pathfinder is also much crunchier than 5th eds restrictively simple system, which I prefer.
Admittedly, yes, I do like simple systems when I just want to have that in the background and focus on the characters and story.
If there was a simplified Pathfinder that's be great, but either way, I despise WOTC and am not going back a second time, not after their latest bazinga skullduggery of subscription seeking and license throttling and treat printers being proposed to replace DMs and tell the main campaign module stories.
Disregard this I didn't notice it was you. That said, have you tried any of those systems? I'd like to hear your thoughts.
Have you tried other systems? D&D is not a very good story telling system. I'm not sure what the state of the art is but systems like Powered By The Apocalypse had a reputation as good story and character focused systems a few years ago. Mouse Guard, Lamentations of the Flame Princess, and Blades in the Dark are all supposed to be quite good for that.
Have you tried other systems?
I've tried many systems but my group often only plays other games for a few sessions before wanting to go back to D&D or D&D-like for the most part and that's why I suggested Pathfinder if someone else is having a similar issue or has similar needs.
I can sometimes go an entire session without a single combat die roll, so I make storytelling happen even in a system that's kind of hostile to it. I do what I have to do.
Hell yeah
I had a blast running Heavy Gear's RPG mode, but Dream Pod 9 sort of abandoned it, switched to "Heroclix" hype then some esports bullshit kickstarter that went nowhere, and the setting's basically dead. 
That's too bad, because Heavy Gear's "Silhouette" system does really fast and exciting high-stakes kick-ass-or-die mecha combat. At the high end it feels like piloting mobile suits that either rock face, fall apart into a failure spiral, or sometimes just instantly explode.
Combat resolves really quickly if you get used to it, almost at the speed of a cinematic story.
: p I had some fun with hero-clix style stuff when I was, like, idk 12? Because it was much easier for me to get in to than WH40k or something. I think the version I played was MageKnight.
I'll have to look up the old Heavy Gear stuff. I really enjoyed the first PC game. My computer could only barely run it, I had to turn on the wireframe mode in any actual fight!
There was a lot of potential for the Heavy Gear series as a RPG setting. Even the characters listed in the core books had a novel "chess piece" system to show how important they might be to future books (so GMs wouldn't get them killed off or otherwise changed too much if they were too important for future canon plots) which made me expect a vast post-interpolar war story spanning the terran colonies on the scale of Legend of the Galactic Heroes, or at least Gundam.
That didn't happen because Heavy Gear became "Clix'd" and sort of abandoned any attempt at a long-running ongoing story, so it was up to me to fill in the blanks for as long as my tabletop group wanted to play.
I'd have to look when I get home, but I've got a fair amount of 5th edition books I'd be willing to let go for not much more than shipping costs...
Feel free to DM me!
Fate is a simple system, not very combat focused, and everything should be available here https://fate-srd.com/fate-core/basics
shakes fist at funny dice
(fate is fine)
(this makes me want to write a system again, though I tend towards wargames as far as rules go)
Do not let WotC trick you into thinking you need to pay them 150 bucks to start a game.
One, sail the high seas if you really wanna play D&D 5th edition (or whatever new edition they come out with).
Secondly, consider other systems. Depending on what exactly you wanna get from D&D (solving problems in a fantasy setting, character customization, playing in a particular setting, character drama in a fantasy setting, battles with cool powers, a sense of progressing from a nobody to a hero, feeling like a hero from day 1, etc) there is probably a better system for that than 5e and the majority of them don't require more than 2, or often even just 1 book. Plus several that have 2 only charge for digital versions of the GM book.
Oh, consider dungeon world. It's a simpler system that lends itself to fail forward, and the basic moves/character sheets are all available for download for free.
Looking at this now. The mechanics look simpler for sure. I’m playing a game just me and my wife and she’s never played a tabletop rpg before, so that might be a good call.
Oh if you've got a new person then fuck d&d unless they really want to specifically play d&d. If not, there are way better systems for shared storytelling. I introduce people to rpging via dungeon world 10 times out of 10.
Monster of the Week? Anything Powered by the Apocalypse is going to be much stronger in Game Master support and explanations than D&D. If you want something friendlier there are also games like Yazeba's Bed and Breakfast that has no focus on combat. Wanderhome, as well -- albeit that one isn't modern. You've got a lot of options, don't be fooled by Hasbro!
If you don’t mind using a different system GURPS has a free 32 page lite version of the system that gives you all the basics
extremely brave recommending gurps to a new dm lmao
As others have said, pirate things. I'd also suggest looking for legally dubious online resources, lots of websites out there that have SRDs and splatbooks laid out in an easier-to-navigate website ways than PDFs.
There are places to find the rules online
Though, I am going to be that guy and tell you that Pathfinder 2e has most of its rules online at this website and it's much better in terms of balance and not being racist
Basic Fantasy is simple to learn, AND ALL THE BOOKS ARE FREE!!! https://www.basicfantasy.org/
The books are also on amazon at like 6-10 a piece if you're in the US.
It's based on the OSR (i.e. Original DnD rules but updated)...
So, when people say use a different system, do you just use a different rulebook for d&d or something?
Dungeons and Dragons is like a specific name-brand RPG product owned by a shitty company called Wizards of the Coast.
Other people and companies make other RPG systems. Pathfinder is probably the biggest and is pretty similar to DnD and has a similar setting. However there's so many games and settings that you can really find something for anyone. Like giant robots? Magical girls? 80s "kids on bikes" adventures? Post apocalypse wastelands? Vampires and werewolves? Etc - there's probably a game that would suit your group
Advising Pathfinder is a terrible for new player. Heck, i played and GM'ed dozens of different systems over 30 years and Pathfinder has been one of the most miserable and abysmal experiences for me.
i'm genuinely curious as to what makes you feel that way, if you're interested in sharing (i promise this is not a weird gotcha)
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Yeah, generally they're playing another D&D-style game, or more rarely a game that's an entirely different genre. Game like Pathfinder (2e is the big internet favorite atm) and OSR games are designed to be basically the same niche genre of "dungeon-crawling, combat-centric high fantasy" but with different rules. Other games like Dungeon World use the same setting concept but the rules are more narrative-focused with less emphasis on hours-long combats on a grid. Further afield are generic systems like FATE, GURPS, Savage Worlds, etc which are flexible and can be used to play whatever genre you want, so they can be D&D-fantasy or cyberpunk, superheroes, historical fantasy, "action movies", etc (though most of these tend to be best at one or a few things). Or you can just play something totally different like Lancer, a game set in the space communist future where you fight slavers and fascist remnants in giant mechs, or Thirsty Sword Lesbians, which I know very little about except that the name is funny and that it is very queer.
Personally I use GURPS, because it does a lot of things I like and because it can be used to run different genres with minimal effort. Things like extreme customizability, crunchy combat that actually has multiple options worth choosing that aren't just 'spam attacks', no HP bloat, point-buy characters with no classes (unless you want them), I could go on.
I loved GURPS. My brother and I played all the time. Also want to shout out Kevin Crawford's Stars without Number if you're looking for a scifi game. He has a free to download basic version, which is fully playable, and a paid version which has some optional rules and tools..
I prefer Basic fantasy for fantasy gaming but Worlds Without Number is also a great option (again free and premium versions)..
D&D kind of sucks, and especially sucks for what you want to do.
- It's not good for 1:1 games. It makes many assumptions about there being a full party
- It doesn't offer much advice for DMing, and has a lot of ways to fuck it up.
- It has like no rules for roleplay. It has very vague "If you roll a high number maybe they'll do you a favor" suggestions, but for something like "I want to stand up straight, look him in the eye, and tell him he should yield or suffer the wrath of my patron" it leaves it entirely up to the DM how to resolve. Other games provide a lot more guidance
- It is entirely combat focused. It is crunchy in annoying ways.
Chronicles of Darkness is modern day occult. it's not very light, but it's closer to what you want. I'm fond of Mage: The Awakening.
Fate is a good general purpose system that's more in line with how I think people imagine RPGs are. It's also free. It cares a lot more about the narrative than D&D. D&D puts most narrative detail squarely in "unimportant flavor". So if your character's story is they were a pirate, that doesn't do anything in the game unless you have the pirate background, and those tend to be very limited. Contrast with Fate that is much more explicit about "Aspects give you permission. If your character has 'Former Pirate' on their sheet, they definitely know some sea shanties and how to move around on a boat". D&D leaves that up to the DM. And then a lot of people are like, if it's leaving so much up to the DM why am I even buying this book.
Powered by the Apocalypse games are also popular. I don't personally like them that much, but I see why people do.
They don't. One of the many, many things that sucks about D&D is that it's the most recognised, so people think it's a good place to start with TTRPGs.
It's not. It has most of the complexity of a crunchy game like PF2e, but no mechanical unification, so every action has its own rule, rather than similar actions just being small variants on the same. Rules are often specific, applying only to certain situations, but still vague, forcing the DM to decide how they're actually meant to be applied. Similarly, it's very crunchy and combat focused but combat is pretty barebones, just being a case of standing in front of an enemy and hitting it until one of you falls over. Could be either you or the enemy, the balance is skewed at best.
As if there weren't enough mechanical problems, the lore stagnated after 3.x, and wasn't that deep even then; The Forgotten Realms setting in particular is extremely barebones once you're off the Sword Coast, and regularly leans all the way over to downright offensive. Like ye olde minstral show racism in stuff printed in the last 5 years. And they charge you a fucking arm and a leg for everything, so, like you say, you need to pay like $150 just to play in a homebrew setting.
You don't want to play D&D. If you do, you want to play Pathfinder 2e, Savage Worlds, or Shadow of the Demon Lord/Weird Wizard instead. Pathfinder in particular has great fey lore, even if you pick a different system it'd be worth looking at Kingmaker for fey storyline ideas.
What you probably want is something like Fate or Monster of the Week, a more storytelling focused system that isn't so balanced around parties. FitD games would also be worth looking at.
One-page RPGs might be better for this than 5e or 5.24. There are literally thousands of them and most of them are free or really cheap.
Regarding Edit 2, when you say more modern do you mean like urban fantasy?
I'm a big fan of the Chronicles of Darkness games (which, fair warning, new books aren't coming out, but you can get a PDF or print on demand copy of any of them, and like most non DND games you're looking at 1 core book only).
I really like Werewolf the Forsaken but it's pretty focused on playing a pack of werewolves. If she's into faeries you could look at Changeling the Lost (which may or may not be suitable, it's about humans who've escaped captivity after being captured by the "True Fae." They're changed by the experience and couldn't fit back into their old lives even if there weren't a doppelganger made of garbage and fae magic living their life, and they may have conflicting feelings about the whole thing anyway, after all if they hadn't gotten kidnapped they wouldn't have learned to magically learn someone's greatest desire or talk to birds or whatever. Worth pointing out that it's a horror game and the fae world kind of represent trauma).
If that one doesn't spark joy, Vampire the Requiem is also really cool and is about trying to survive as a relatively new vampire in a cutthroat, backward citywide society of the undead. It's not about violence in the sense of combat but vampires are obviously predatory so this could also maybe not be right.
The same line of games has one about being a wizard in the modern day, but it's extremely heavy and crunchy and probably not what you're looking for.
If you mean you're interested in non-fantasy modern settings I don't know much about the available games but I'm sure there are some decent ones someone else will mention.
There's a podcast that only does 1 on 1 RP games called Party of One. It might give you two some ideas!
5e tools, that'll help you with mechanics and items. If you want the books, DM me and I'll throw you a link to my drive where I got some of em stored, including the newest phb.
Though, you said she wanted something more modern. Maybe try CBR + PNK? The gist of it is, it's the character's last job. The character sheet fits on a pamphlet. If you want something a bit more detailed but still with ample room for mechanics, I'm reading through Savage Worlds and it looks superior to 5e in regards of speed of combat and roleplayability. Plus, there's loads of third party content to make the system fit pretty much any setting, including weird west (Deadlands), cyberpunk (there's a bunch of them), superheroes (i think it was called Capes, but I might be wrong), to fantasy (Paizo made a Pathfinder port to Savage Worlds).
As someone who just recently (1yr) started DM'ing, go for something simple. Don't drown yourself in options. And try not to homebrew too much. Go for a one-shot, but feel free to stretch it out to two or three sessions. You need any help, my DM's are open. 5e isn't as simple as some people say due to mistakes done by WotC and you need some elbow grease to buff it out as a DM.
this post was submitted on 25 Sep 2024
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