If we want to rename things (Mexico was a LOT larger in the olden times) why don't we call it "Gulf of the Americas?"
Oh because it doesn't support imperial single minded nationalism and isn't USA centered
America is a continent, not a country. "Americas" is as correct as "Europes". But certainly those who decided to call it gulf of america are not aware of that.
Where and when was this decided by the Indigenous people of North America?
I'm interested to learn more about this. I've never heard this name when I studied the history of North America,
No because it’s not a homogeneous people so it would have many different names/this wouldn’t be coordinated across NA
I unironically support this
while I like this, I don't think I would be able to pronounce it, lol
Looks like "not exactly," but it's cool nonetheless:
https://davidbowles.medium.com/pre-invasion-nahuas-and-the-gulf-of-mexico-22f30c515724
Pfft. Lousy historians and their stupid . . research.
I'm just happy that this semi-true fact led me to learn a whole lot about the nahuatl and their history!
Never heard of this goddess before but im glad i did. She's got some really awesome depictions!
Yep... She's got some great 'depictions' 👉😏👉
Always wanted a woman with a snake moustache!
I need to understand the snake moustache. Is it a water breather so she can breathe above water while she feeds her children. She's really pulling that overtime.
Also, who skinned the baby? He seems pretty unperturbed though.
She of the Jade Skirt: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chalchiuhtlicue
"Gulf of the Jade Skirt" sounds kinda badass.
I really wish we could actually "rename" places as their original indigenous names across all America(~~s~~). For example my country had an internal turmoil just to keep the original name of its capital city because we love our native people, and yet we keep the incredibly stupid name of "Land of Colon" (imho most probably the most stupid name of any country, ever) because fuck our native people.
I like that we call it Denali nowadays instead of Mount McKinley. I'm all for this.
Now if I could just get South Dakota to issue me a new license plate without those faces carved into the mountain...
I’m practicing the pronunciation right now.
No problem, I'm Welsh
How are you coping with the over abundance of vowels?
When every letter is a vowel, none of them are.
I've said for decades that in order to cope with an insane world, people take up unjustifiable positions. Some people turn to God, others believe in causes, or whatever.
Mine is that Wales isn't real and your language is a psyop. I'm sorry.
Somebody teach me the basic pronounciation, so I can make a slightly less fool of myself when trying to say it, and I'm on board with that.
I'm all for finding a middle ground, which is why I will call it the Gulf of Canada, USA, and Mexico. Or Gulf of C.U.M. for short.
BP Playground
I'll do this starting NOW, if someone will just post a pronunciation guide! Please?
Chalchiuhtlicue [t͡ʃaːɬt͡ʃiwˈt͡ɬikʷeː]
Best I can do is this: chal-chew-KLEE-kway
With some help from Forvo. The [t͡ɬ] sounds like KL to my Canadian ears and not TL (which doesn't happen at the start of syllable in English anyway).
Edit: apparently that's just rhe the deity... Not sure what to do with the last few letters. "eh-kattle"?
Yep, that's just the deity.
There's also pronunciation videos, FYI: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pklyVXkYgk&t=35s
Thanks: that's gonna take some practise!
My gal spelt out “Chalchiuhtlicueyecati” but abbreviated “associated with.”
If human bodies are mostly water, does that mean Chalchiuhtlicue has dominion over us, too? 🤔
Agree, at least it's the original name
Anybody got a pronunciation key?
I think nobody would complain if you pronounced it "Cha Cha cat"
If I could heard that pronounced I would totally start call it that too
Same. I see the wiki link, but those symbols mean nothing to me.
@Sal@mander.xyz - Do you know? I couldn't find many sources but I only speak English.
EDIT: As indepndnt mentioned in a comment below, the OP was posted on February 14, which pre-dates the wikipedia edits. So, my conclusions below about the timeline are not valid.
Hah, sure, let's investigate 🕵️♂️
The term 'Chalchiuhtlicueyecatl' was added as a potential Aztec name to the English wikipedia page on February 15, 2025, by user 'Mxn'.
The description of the edit is the following:
Frum says the Aztecs had no specific name for the gulf, which is plausible in a practical sense, but Fernández gives a specific religious name and is more of a reliable source on this topic
If we investigate a bit further, we can see that the term Chalchiuhtlicueyecatl is described to be a name for the 'Gulf of Mexico' in the spanish Wikipedia: https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chalchiuhtlicueyecatl
This page was updated to include the description of Chalchiuhtlicueyecatl as the 'Gulf of Mexico' in September 16, 2018. I don't have access to the citation so I don't know if the citation specifies if this term is still known/used.
If you check the history you will find that the same 'Mxn' fixed a typo in this page on February 15, 2025.
So, from this sequence of events it is highly likely that the term 'Chalchiuhtlicueyecatl' was included into the Gulf of Mexico wiki page as a result of the user Mxn performing an active search for Aztec names for the Gulf of Mexico, and finding this connection between the term an the gulf by searching on Wikipedia. This information did not come from recent news about the term being used by natives.
I can find no evidence of native people referring to the gulf of Mexico as 'Chalchiuhtlicueyecatl' more frequently or at all. I can find no mention of this becoming viral in Mexico.
I find it highly unlikely that:
AND
More likely....
And this concludes my little investigation 🧐
Haha, fantastic. Thank you for your work. ALAS! We have uncovered a deeper mystery! 🔍🔎🔎🔍🔎 🤔
Is this the book? https://annas-archive.org/md5/fb8569c405991107b987fda775f49ba2
Yes, but that version is in German. That website also has one in English: https://annas-archive.org/slow_download/24154814bfe1e676d79509c3db1f74a4/0/0
Let's see...
Woah, interesting. The author is José López Portillo. I thought he shared the name with a former Mexican president, but, nope, the author is a former Mexican president.
The title of the English version is a bit different, but the text appears to be the same. It is a novel, and I can find no mention of the gulf of Mexico or of Chalchiuhtlicueyecatl in this book. To me it looks like a mistake in the citation.
The claim appears to come from this text (citation 1): https://www.scribd.com/document/703207646/Dioses-prehispanicos-de-Mexico-mitos-y-deidades-del-panteon-Fernandez-Adela-1992-Mexico-D-F-Panorama-Editorial-9789683803061-cbee5
Unfortunately, that book does not contain references nor is it stated where this claim comes from.
Damn, look at you being awesome!
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